Intro Im an AP, lets smash the casinos together!!

She could still give it a good tickle even though she can't see it, so what's the problem?

 

Bombus 3 Everyone else 0

 

Perhaps you're right.

But no man will ever fuck her.

 

18,000 in the state, and 95% of them are garbage, again, wouldn't and will not be hard to find you when I do come out, Mickey. I'm basically done with anything north of I70 until March, so it'll be a little bit before I head up your way

I'm just curious Mickey, why didn't you quote the body of the message, rather than the title?

"Educate me" is not, "Oh great Mickey, teach me about your plays". It could very simply be, "Educate me on where you found X or Y machine. I'm willing to share information back and forth with you if you're willing", or, " I looked at X or Y machine you mentioned in your post, and couldn't not find the advantage you're claiming, educate me on how you think this is a play".

There's a lot more to be said than a Header, Mickey.

No, it looks like our resident "best of all time" machine pro, Exoter175, was OUT making money, Mickey. You know, the thing you claim to do? Only difference is, like I've mentioned a dozen times now, I travel around, and just as I mentioned to several on this forum, I'd be traveling between Omaha, Des Moines, and Minneapolis this week/weekend, again. You'll notice here, like on the other forum, Mickey, that I generally don't post much between Thursday-Sunday, unless its late, or I'm just arriving home from out of town.

But fuck that logic, right? That makes too much sense, clearly the guy who doesn't even "work" at what we do anymore, thinks I ran off because I was "working".

Axel, I bring your name up because you're relevant, if that offends you, I'm sorry., but understand that I don't need your recognition, Mickeys recognition, or anyone else's. Read my posts here on this forum, there aren't many. I joined to call out a guy who said he had a system to beat roulette, and because I saw Mickey posting over here, and I can't "access" WoV so him and I can't go back and forth. So far, so good. I read a post about a guy named Richie, and I ask him if he is one and the same. Mickey, shits all over the thread calling me a phony, when he very clearly hasn't figured out the Mermaid play as evidenced by his thread on it that I had also read.

That's not me looking for recognition, that's me looking to find out if Richie is the guy I'm looking for, and defending myself against the old, senile, holier than thou, DRUNK Mickey Crimm.

If you need validation to whether or not I'm the real deal, come find me. You're one of the rare few posters on the multitude of forums I read, that I'd be willing to meet in person. If you find your way east of the Rockies and West of the Mississippi, drop me a line. I value information above all else, and I'm more than certain 5 minutes into a conversation between us, you'd be 110% sold on me being the real deal, and having angles on machines most people wouldn't think of.

Its like you've said, and I've mentioned your name with before, I don't like posting the plays on a public forum for all to see. I certainly don't want to tip off the competition to what I'm doing in the first place, let alone the Casino and the Game Developers. In regards to your IJ comment, I was being explicitly vague on purpose, in a similar style to the post Richie mentioned, and again has to do with my view, which aligns with yours, about not giving away plays online, or to the public.

I legitimately do not recall you telling me the S&H was coupled with a promotion, I could have sworn you were telling me that it had decent head, and a regular crowd working in. I can't access WoV to look at the dialogue between us, but I do recall listing a few machines saying I'd pay a finders fee to someone who found them, IJ, PE, SW, Jaws, CE, being the primary ones I was searching for, but was also looking for S&H's simply for nostalgia. Kind of how I was looking for an Alice as well.

Also, what outrageous money claims are we talking about? Because Mickey is over here claiming $540/day, and now $300/day in Montana.

If that doesn't shoot up red flags that say "bullshit" on them, I don't know what would.

Mickey, I don't comment on some of the other plays like Piggy Bankin because they aren't around anymore. Most everything you've posted about, hasn't been in a casino in 10 years, with two exceptions. One was a year ago, and it was a minor deal, the other being this one with the Mermaid. Now, I don't have a problem with you telling someone they could make a buck on it, I have a problem with you discussing it on an open forum, claiming to be the worlds most knowledgeable hustler in the business, courting writers to write stories about you from back in your "Silver Mining" days, and your claims to fame, meanwhile you're drunk as a skunk, holed up in a state that doesn't matter, pretending like you've found fort knox, yet, I promise you I have 15+ machines on rotation that you have ZERO clue about because your experience is no longer relevant. Its evidenced by you taking such an old game like Mermaid, and pretending like its the next best thing and you were the one that pioneered it. Meanwhile I've probably had 3 or 4 handpays on it in the last 3 years. I don't NEED you to tell me anything, but I'm always willing to listen.

I saw you posting about some of the old stuff so I approached you after a comment you made about a play familiar to me, to gauge your knowledge on it, thus the "Teach Me" rhetoric you're going on about. Its obvious in your postings that you seek attention and fame for your exploits, almost as if a lush (gasp, shock, horror) at the bar were telling one of his unbelievable stories. So, lets just cut down to the chase. At one point, you were relevant, you were likely one of the best, but you go old, lazy, tired, or what have you, and you grew darker inside. Now you just shit on anybody else who can challenge your "internet claim to fame" by being better, or more relevant. Newsflash, you're not making friends by giving up information about how I put food on the table, if anything, you're making enemies because you're affecting our bottom dollar, but because you don't get a play on these things in Montana, where there's barely enough action to keep ONE of my casinos alive, you think its okay to kill the play for everyone. This is why I left Las Vegas for KC, and then KC for the road. Guys like you giving away all the fucking details to anybody who would listen because your ego can't be contained, you HAVE to tell people that you're able to beat the casino, and do it on a machine!

I'm not sure what kind of scoring system you're using, but Mickey is not even "IN" the argument anymore after he lashed out like he won when I was WORKING and he was DRINKING.

I knew this guy in Kansas City once, old school hustler a lot like Mickey. Name is "Grandpa Tom", or "Ponytail" if you've ever been through KC->STL area checking X's. He has a drinking problem, and he'll be quick to fire up about how much he makes, how great he is, and how he's never lost in 9 years; but at the end of the day, he doesn't leave the Argosy in KC because he can't get free alcohol and free rooms anywhere else, and so he doesn't leave. Despite the fact that he's basically killed all action there over the years, to where you're talking about it being like a $40/day affair there.

This is Mickey in a nutshell.

 

So which is it, Exotard? I don't work anymore or I'm making outrageous claims about what I make. You can't get your story straight, idiot.

FYI, there was another idiot that posted here for awhile. He told me I was full of shit about what I make too? So I posted this up. It's on page 4 of the What Is An AP Play? in the slots forum. If the link don't work just go to page 4 of that thread. You will see there is a newpaper laying behind the money with the date, June 6, which, as you will see, is the same day I made the post. I made the same challenge to Rob Singer. They talked, talked, talked, denied, denied, denied, but neither took the bet.

https://www.gamblingforums.com/threads/what-is-an-ap-play.5288/p

 

95% of them are garbage, eh? Very prophetic of you. Hey guess what, 95% or more of machines in all states are garbage, numnuts.

Now, for the educate me part. I have absolutely nothing to gain by showing you any of my plays....and I don't care about your plays. So there is no way in hell I'm going to cut my own throat by showing you anything. And why do I get the feeling that if I did, the information you give me would just be nickel and dime bullshit? After all, you ARE a hustler. Not a very good one but a hustler none the less.

 

Once again, I never said Mermaid was the next best thing to come along. It's a fucking minor play at best compared to what I do. I never said I pioneered it either. You are making shit up in your delusional fucked up head. You are a compulsive liar.

 

This is a disgustingly foul post if you read the whole thing. He thinks insults will do the trick. That you will spill the beans on your plays.

I'm now suggesting to AP's everywhere to freeze exoter175 out. Do no become engaged with him. Boycott him. Do not tell him anything about your plays. Do not let him know what market you are in.

He is trying to hustle all AP's out of information....and I guarantee you the information you get in return won't be worth a plug nickel. The lowlife is trying to hustle the hustlers.

 

Exotor you were in vegas? If so when and what did you play?

What games are you playing now?

 

"The requested page could not be found."

What story is it that I can't seem to get straight, Mickey?

You both make outrageous claims at how much money you make, and don't work nearly as much as you used to, and don't work nearly as much as you let on.

You wouldn't have hassled me for a response like you did here on this forum, if you understood what my life entailed with "being on the road". Like, not having the luxury to respond to Mickey Crimm immediately when I'm driving 8+ hours out of town and not planning on being home for days.

I'm not saying you don't make money, the current machines you've been trying to burn me on lately show that you know what to look for at least, and probably know quite a few others that I still play, but you write them off because you refuse to relocate your efforts in a better position, or simply because your "keno" plays are enough. Having said that, 9 straight years of $540/day, is just shy of $1.8M, and I can tell you for a fact you aren't sitting on $1.8M in the bank, and you certainly haven't been putting it in the stock market.

No, Mickey, you saved up a giant nest egg to buy a house, buy a car, and put away just enough to retire on, while getting a steady, albeit small, weekly income from hustling. I'd bet you honestly make less than $1,000/week , week after week where you are, and that's probably giving you and your state, way too much credit,

Hey, jerkoff, did you think that my knowledge of 95% of machines beging garbage in all states is why I made that comment? How very prophetic of you to literally repeat what I said.

But wait, there's more, here you go on about not giving me plays beacuse that would be cutting your own throat, yet you do it on every forum you post on. That's my problem with you, mostly, aside from you calling me a phony. I'm not asking for your big plays, and you still haven't posted the body of the message, Mickey, why? I can't do it, I'm banned, only you can show us that bit of information. Its not like I can go on that forum again to find the post you made that "urged" me to PM you either, but lets not play around like you're holding all the cards kiddo, we're both hustlers, not just me. The difference between us is that you started from being the bottom of the barrel, the gum on a boot, a "Buffalo Hunter", a "Silver Miner", a "Seagull", and you were breaking the law by STEALING. I know better than that. I know what my time is worth. You stumbled into hustling, I was practically born into it.

Compulsive liar? I'd have to be compulsive, first, and a liar, second. What have I lied on? What have I been compulsive about? You're the one being argumentative and aggressive, meanwhile being on a big defensive when I comment about you. Seems to me you're protecting far more lies than I am, or perhaps its just the sauce. Right? Just blame it on your alcoholism? That's an easy out.

You're a drunk and a gambler, and a tramp, and a thief, Mickey. Don't pretend like you're classy, like you're a professor of all things. At the end of the day, you'd pick a penny up off the street.

Also, I never said you said you claimed to be the one to pioneer it, I just said that I found it years before you did and I don't appreciate you posting about a CURRENT game. What might be a "minor" play for you, isn't a "minor" play for me in a state where the cows don't outnumber the people. Have some respect for the hustle, and respect for your fellow APs you drunken fool.

The fact that you think that you have ANY kind of pull to keep ANY AP away from engaging with me is hilarious, and you think I'm the delusional one.

I'm not hustling hustlers, Mickey, I'm trading information with them. You can take that as you like, but the information I get from these guys is really location based information, rather than anything else. The ONE time I've ever "learned" of a new play from a hustler, I turned around and gave him one he didn't know about in trade, not because I owed him, but because he deserved it.

He gave me that play, though, because I'm a fair and reasonable human being, because I'm likeable, and because I'm simply good at what I do. Five minutes into a conversation with me, I'll make you a believer, and you'll hate it because you have this delusion of who I am or might be, perhaps you're upset because you've been worked over by a smooth talker before, and so when I said I "fleece" these guys, you think I'm talking about stealing their plays and running them out of town, when the reality is, I'm getting information on where to go, because I've gained their trust. A lot of times, we even swap phone numbers to "keep up" with communication about ongoing plays or to call guys in for support. As most of the guys I've met have mostly all been your stereotypical "vulture", who probably doesn't have more than a $500 Bankroll at any time, so I create a network with these guys and let them know that these plays that take a 20k, 50k, 100k bankroll, I'll cover them on, I just need the information and notification.

I've never once cut any hustler out of his fair share, and I've been more than lenient with most everyone in a team setting. All I expect out of you if you work for me or hustle alongside with me, is that you follow a common code or set of "rules" and that you respect one another, the establishment, and most of all, the patrons.

I can't stand, and won't stand a guy who "burns down" a place simply because he refuses to play fair with others. Seems to ring a bell, Mickey. Care to tell us the real story about Vegas now?

You know I can't tell you what I played and what I'm playing now, Axel, though I'm sure Mickey can lay it out for you.

I'm there every year for months, but for a time around '09-'11 I was there for probably 5 months out of each year, give or take. If you're a Vegas local, you know what season that coincides with

 

So you can't tell me what type of plays or name any of them? I.E. I played must hits, I played sticky bonus games, white wizzard, volcano's, UX, LOR, Mermaids.

 

Axel, let me jog your memory. On WoV:

Forum: Gambling
Thread: Guy claims to have invented a BJ betting system
Date thread started: Oct 7, 2015

Exoter gets into a discussion on the Martingale claiming it would work if there weren't table limits and you had an infinite bankroll. There was a back and forth debate. Then you made a post and politely said:

"I apologize in advance because I didn't read all the comments and only part of exoter175's because the marty topic is a waste of time....I'm not defending Martingale because it doesn't work...." You were very polite in the post.

The first sentence of exoter's response to you was "I don't care WHAT you believe." Exoter was starting to show his colors getting combative about people having a different opinion than him.

Mathextremist, jumped in the thread explaining "if you have an infinite bankroll you cannot win more money." This sent Exoter off the deep end. The more the debate on marty went on the more combative exoter got. Even 1BB asked exoter why he was so combative, using vulgar language, and insulting people.

Later on in the thread exoter explained to you that you may have vultured some plays in your lifetime but didn't have his experience and there were plenty of plays he knew about that you could never figure out without some schooling by him. I was reading all this in amazement and amusement. Axel, he didn't know who the hell you were. He had no idea that you are one of the original top machine pros in the world going back to the early nineties, have worked hundreds of different plays, and are recognized by top flight machine pros as one of the best in the business. I don't know of one top flight machine pro who hasn't heard of you. I've known about you for 20 years.

And he had no clue that mathextremist is one of the best video game designers in the business and certainly one of the strongest mathematicans in gambling.

It was this arrogance from an egotistical little prick that no top flight AP's ever heard of before that turned me off to exoter175. That's why I hit him hard when he signed up here. He can kiss my ass.

 

Gentlemen, exotard's assumptions are all based in ignorance and stupidity and are far from the truth. He has no clue. I've been on 2 one-week road trips in the past month. I got home last week and spent a couple of days in the bar. That's my usual habit. Then I sober up and take care of business. I have casinos in my hometown so work them too when I'm at
home...but I don't put in as many hours in a day as on road trips.

Today I hit the first slot parlor at 8:30 AM. By 2:00 PM I had made $249 then took care of other business. Where am I at for the month of November? Well, we're about halfway through the month and I have a $2145 earn. But....I've only worked 7 days this month....and with conditions the way they are at the present, the earn is about par for the course.

Exoter, what happens over there in the midwest when you knock a meter down on a machine? The same thing happens here, dipstick. That machine is dead in the water for you until it gets a bunch of meter buildup again. So what happens when you knock down all the ripe meters in a casino? That casino is dead in the water for you. It needs soak time.

I don't have enough machines here to work it 365 days a year because of the soak time factor. 9 years ago it was worth about $300 a day working half the days in a year. That lasted a few years. Then some new exploitable games came out with higher hourly rates. My daily average went up to $572. That lasted until earlier this year. I banked up a lot of money in the time frame.

When I got hit with the perfect storm of three manufacturers sending the meters back to reset earlier this year I took the whole summer off. But I'm back hitting it now. And exotard can suck my rebel dick.

 

mickey 2 exoter 0

 

THAT'S EXTREMELY GENEROUS! I don't claim to be the top anything or even close. I certainly wasn't a schlub and I have figured out and played some very interesting things others didn't. Especially if there was a different unconventional angel to it.

Many others have done better financially than I.

Although I didn't live on the street or ride the rails. I didn't come from money, not even close to middle class. I was on my own in vegas at 18. I was in my early 20's when I quit my $8 an hr job with no car, I needed a roommate, and I had less than 1k to my name. I had no mentors, no books, or computers. AP's were not that forthcoming about information. Everything was a learning process from yourself and the people you surrounded yourself with. Knowing who to surround yourself with and who to trust was and is paramount. With everything I had to work with and without a higher education. Considering I had an issue that almost killed me(they told my GF I wouldn't make it through the night) and I had to start over after being out of commission for a few years, many would say it's impressive.

I don't need to fluff anything up or make outrageous claims because anything I have to say is real and interesting enough without any BS.

I'm definitely not as sharp, ambitious or on top of every little thing nowadays. Especially when it comes to hustling the UX, bonus machines, must hits and hitting up the casinos daily. You can't be everywhere and do everything out there. I prefer to make bigger plays with a juicy percentages and have multiple people helping. We are well diversifies in multiple didn't things and are always adding new things and looking to the future.

 

I said I didn't want to name them, Axel, for the very reason you and I agree on, but everything you've mentioned, I've played, including their variants like RE for the WW, ED and JR for the WM. If that doesn't give you a tidbit, I don't know what will. You know I won't mention it because I"m not a fuckwad like Mickey is, do you need an email so you can validate me or something, because I did a pretty damned good job on WoV making it as obvious as I could that I know what I"m doing, what I'm talking about, and likely more than most.

Do you know how badly I want to just add a list of 30-40 machines on top of the one you just posted, including ALLLLL of the variants just to prove my point? I'd love to, but in some way, being a national player, it will hurt me. I don't need more bottom feeders, more competition all around, I just want location information, which was the whole reason I joined WoV, and partially why I joined here (to get in contact with Richie if that were indeed the same richie to let him know I found his game).

You didn't hit me hard at all, you just called me a phony. That hurts me no more than you being called a drunk. Only difference I can prove myself by burning all plays (and won't) and you can't prove to make nearly as much as you claim, or to stay sober for that matter, and which do you believe is more believable? A drunken "hustler" who stays in Montana claiming to make $500 a day in a state with 18k machines, or a self described "jack of all trades" AP who has 18k machines within a 20 minute drive of his home, and travels 30-40 states a year and claims a little more than half that amount?

Arguing with you doesn't do any of us good Mickey, because you make yourself look bad claiming you've never had a losing day in 9 years, or making 500+ a day in that time, totaling just shy of $2 million which you can't prove, and I get labeled that guy who can't be wrong, trying to argue with the drunk who doesn't give a shit if what he says is true or not.

As far as Math Extremist goes, that argument came down to two things. 1. The Theory of Infinite losses wasn't able to be proven, and 2. The theory of an infinite bankroll was impossible because money is finite. The thread ended because Math Extremist refused to answer what would happen at the completion of the cycle, when the martingale won. The answer, of course, is that the player would have one more unit than they began with, thus proving that in a "perfect world" where a player could chase his losses to a win indefinitely, the system would "work".

The argument was sprung when someone misunderstood my intent, which was that because of this system and many others like it, table limits were imposed.

I don't need soak time, Mickey. I work 5 days a week when I decide to stay home, Noon-10PM+ Wednesday-Sunday, and usually until about 1-2am on Thursday/Friday/Saturday.

I have a ton of machines and ground to cover in a day, Mickey, and I'll crank out on average $1,200/wk at a SINGLE CASINO like clockwork without traveling. I travel, because I can make MORE, and thus I've trained a team of players who can hustle "home" while I'm on the road. As players get banned or burn out, I have to replace them, or incur more road expenses if I take a locally banned player on the road with me. I take care of my own, and there's quite a few guys and even some girls that depend on me. If the average Casino My team and I covered in a week had 2,000 machines Mickey, I'd have at least 46,000 machines to cover in a given week like clockwork, and a solid ~800 of them can be hustled.

You have what? 50? 100? 150 max? Allow me to roll my eyes because you've traveled twice in a month. I'm on the road 18+days out of the month, minimum.

You can't do what I do, Mickey, end of story. You're too drunk, too much of a gambler, and far too untrustworthy, as evidenced here by your penchant to "expose" plays online because you don't get plays on them locally. Its that kind of ignorance that makes you an enemy to hustlers, Mickey, and yet you DARE to ask others to blackball me while you BURN their plays?

Get the fuck out of here you drunk, ignorant, buffoon. You are a hasbeen, and your days of making good money are over because you've settled for the sauce. You yourself have mentioned you can't get around as well anymore, and that right there makes you a liability on the job, so you have to settle for "longer" plays rather than short ones. I hope you do well because I'm a decent human being who wants nothing but the best for everyone, but don't condescend me with your bullshit when you've never had more than a single human being depending on you to make money.

Are you counting the numbers of beers mickey has been drinking? If so, you're wayyyyyyyyy behind brother.

I like you Axel, not because You're a likeable guy, but because you and I see eye to eye on a great many things in this "hustler" world, and I respect that. I respect the hell out of anyone who has and shares the same respect for others in this "industry" as I do, and I know without a doubt you'd be a valuable member to any team. I'd bankroll you in a heartbeat, and share every bit of knowledge with you, knowing you wouldn't be cutthroat about our business and try to cut me off if we worked the same angle. You're an agreeable human being, and I'd imagine you'd honor the same "code of conduct" that my group of guys works by.

Criminals like Mickey, however, going out there to expose our plays, our bread and butter, our livelihood to others because he's ignorant, I can't respect that, not for a second. He's the kind of "Bottom feeding lowlife" I refer to in the other thread, and his argument here, his posting commentary, proves it.

 

What you need to be, exotard, is an honest mothefucker.

 

He actually thinks all this speach is going to get him something. Boycott like a motherfucker.