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Lounge Is it me, or is Kewlj trying to get on every thread...

Discussion in 'Lounge' started by nate, Jun 17, 2016.

  1. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

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    I do talk regularly to ZG. He is living in a communal setting here in Vegas. I also talk regularly to Creeping Panther (remember him). Despite that I don't agree with some, maybe even 'many' of his views, he too understands inner peace and happiness.

    Coincidentally (or probably not), both of these guys made the migration from Ken's site to Qfit's site and were among many that Norm systematically got rid. ZG was among the first to go...Norm couldn't wait to exile him. CP hid under a different name, but once Norm figured it out, he found a reason to eliminate him. Over time, Norm (who I suspect is one of those you call friend or have great respect for) got rid of anyone who he had ever had any kind of issue with and that included many successful and knowledgeable AP's. And there were many more like Auto Monk that didn't even attempt to make the journey because of Norm and knowing what would come. Other like Bojack hid under a different name and posted a bit, but couldn't take it and left on their own. And that's why Norm's site is what it is today.
     
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  2. shadroch

    shadroch Member

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    Yes,
    Norm is one of the two people I consider a friend and have great respect for. You were the other. You'll noticed I have not said a word in Norms defense, have I? You might remember I was one of the first to bail on his forum, as well. As a mathematician, Norm is without peer. As a forum administrator, I wasn't impressed.
    Almost everyone made the jump from Kens site to Norms. I think most of us thought it would be an intermediate step to a new and better forum.

    As for Ego being a little book-its ranked 116 overall on Amazon, and in the top ten in both business and self help. Its author is in the top five selling authors on Amazon. I'll repeat what I said earlier- I wish I'd read this thirty years ago. I'd probably have retired at 45 instead of 58. That's how much I learned from it.
     
  3. LovePotion9

    LovePotion9 Member

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    you don't need to. it's pretty clear to everyone here who's side you are on...................

    also why do you keep beating a dead horse here? you've already said your piece so why not move on?
    or is your "ego" not allowing you to do so?
     
  4. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

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    I am not much of a reader. I am from the wait for the movie or video generation. :p But I did order your "little book" earlier today. I still feel like the suggestion was an attempted poke at me.

    As a mathematician, particularly in the field of blackjack Norm knows his stuff. I don't know if he is without peer...maybe he is, I am not qualified to say that. I am a simple math guy playing a level 1 count...:D. His software is also extraordinary.

    But I don't know why people raise these points when talking about forum issues. Shackleford did this as well. When discussing why I should not be allowed to voice my professional opinion of Norm's site and those on Norm's site, Shackleford said of Norm "He is also on the short list of the best blackjack mathematicians out there". What on earth did that have to do with anything we were discussing? All that did was show admiration from one math guy to another and probably more important was almost proof that Shackleford was unable to be objective in the matter.

    OJ Simpson was a great football player....that doesn't translate to anything else. Norm is an outstanding mathematician and software guy....that does not translate to anything in the world of forums administrator or participation. Funny, obviously Shackleford is also among the top math guys in the world of gambling. Those two are so similar, so cut from the same cloth, almost clones. Freakishly strong math guys, with poor social skills, running forums for which they are not suited or qualified to do.
     
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  5. whodat

    whodat Member

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    KJ,

    I have read Shadroch's posts and I think he is on the level when trying to recommend this book to you. In fact, I am going to take a look at this book myself.
    Thanks, Shadroch.
     
  6. shadroch

    shadroch Member

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    I respect Norm because he is one of the top math people in the field. My Uncle retired as Head of the Math Dept. at a mid level college in NY and ,in his sixties proceeded to make a few million dollars trading derivatives. He was very dubious about card counting but agreed to look at a program I had. He recognized Norms name and pretty much said if Norm signed off, it must be sound. Is he literally THE top guy in the world? I doubt it, and I'm sure he wouldn't claim it.
    You and he had problems. I get it. You don't respect him. I do. Does that make me your enemy? I hope not.
     
  7. redietz

    redietz Well-Known Member

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    I need a scorecard. Obviously, a key issue here is why did Norm allow his associate to recommend or sell a complicated/expensive system if it was not appropriate for beginners? Is it a consensus that it was not appropriate?
     

  8. shadroch

    shadroch Member

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    If I understand him correctly,KJ said most of the offending posts were scrubbed so reading the threads retroactively doesn't tell the whole story.
    I wasn't there when it went down.
     
  9. Don'tLookNow

    Don'tLookNow Member

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    Seriously, the top of which "field" of mathematics?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Fields_of_mathematics

    Which, if true, proves what here?
     
  10. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

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    No, you are not the enemy and I do respect Norm. I respect that he is a mathematical 'genius'. I respect that his contribution to the BJ community in the form of his outstanding software products have benefited so many in the community at all levels, myself very much included in that large group. That contribution alone would likely have him in the BJ hall of fame, if he didn't have personality conflicts/feuds with so many throughout the community. He also had what I believe one of the best, most thorough and complete books on blackjack play available in Modern Blackjack. Far different from other publications, not only because of Norm's liberal use of charts and graphs, which makes all his data so understandable, but because it was written for the current conditions of today, not the 1980/1990's. Modern Blackjack is very underrated and under appreciated and not even well known, because of the way Norm released it as an e-book only (at least at first). But all that admiration melts away when you have to deal with him personally.

    Admittedly, I have a real hard time relating with what I call 'math guys'. They all have real "funny" (odd) personalities and they often lose me in conversation when they get into numbers and formulas and that comes across even worse in written discussions, like a message board. Maybe they have extra math genes that gobbles up the people-person, social skills, genes. :rolleyes: For all their math superiority, they are totally unqualified, and unable to run a message board site. And Norm is by far the worst, although Shackleford is running close behind.

    Norman brings out the worst in me, a side of me that I usually don't even recognize, and very often am embarrassed about when I look back a day or two later. And not to run from the responsibility of that, but I see him bring out the same "very worst" in so many other's. There has to be something to that! And now I see almost the exact same situation with Shackleford.
     
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  11. AxelWolf

    AxelWolf Well-Known Member

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    I agree highly intelligent math guys are wired differently.

    You think this to be the case, so shouldn't you approach the situation differently with and when dealing with them?

    Maybe you cannot fault them for that, just like people shouldn't fault you for being born gay. You too should work towards acceptance tolerance.

    Mike may have handled this poorly, but as far as I can tell so did you. You of all people should be more forgiving considering some of the shenanigans you pulled. You said you had a good reason perhaps he did/does as well.

    Mike tried to make up for it and get you back on the forum. Given time, I'm sure he would have even went further and did more to make up for everything that happened in his own way(perhaps he would have helped promote your book or something). I would think he's a fairly busy guy with the website, sports, friends, family, traveling, business, analyzing promos(BOO!!!) etc etc. It's not as if you are/were the only thing he had on has mind or the only problem he had to face. You certainly were not making it easy for him. It seems to me you wanted Mike to kiss your ass, make some grand gesture and him to turn on/denounce Norm.

    Sorry KJ, but i think you crossed the line with Mike on this one, you should have taken a break let things cool down and worked something out.

    FYI Mike has always taken the time to meet up with members, help them with math problems and various other things.

    I think you are just causing more animosity in the AP community by keeping this up. Move on, let it go, you are only hurting yourself and others. It's Probably not hurting Mike I think he has a Fuck you life and Fuck you money. IMO theres is nothing you can say or do at this point, people have already made up their minds. Its actually done more harm to you than anyone else. IE. Some people think you're NUTS, obsessed and perhaps unstable. Many people wouldn't have known about all this death faking and someone even said they doubt your reason for doing it.
    My point is people are talking negative about you behind the scenes and in private. That could affect your career and you don't even know it. As you said, you like to keep your options open but this could be closin doors.

    And remember this, other than a few hard core hateres, for every person that claim they support you, they would probably tell Mike they support him. People like to play both sides and suck up to whomever they are around or talking to at the time. Many people seriously only care about whomever is putting their food on their table.
     
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  12. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

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  13. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

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    Stop bringing up gay references. I swear you are obsessed with gayness. :p Me being gay has nothing to do with any of this. Nor does it define me, so please stop with your obsession.

    Like Mike (aka weasel ;)) I have acknowledged that I haven't handled everything well. But I haven't handled things well in the aftermath. He didn't handle thing well in the original situation (which he admitted). Without his initial "not handling well" or if he had manned up and fixed it within a reasonable period of time there would be no "aftermath".

    But I don't get you guys, first RS and now you that come here and tell me I should have been more patient. I am hearing things like "given time....", and" Mike was working to....". WTF AxelWolf it has been 4 months! Four months that I have been exiled while Norm is allowed to periodically pop in to attack me. What exactly is this "process" that Mike was working on, that needed more time?? Might I remind you that Mike is the man, in this situation. The president. The King. The decision maker. There was no process necessary. If he wanted it to happen, it would have happened. But it didn't...that should tell you how much he wanted it to happen. How much he valued me despite his claims.

    Funny thing about "this process". There wasn't much of a process when he banned me. No discussion or talking anything through or even taking time to think things through. Instantanious decision. Know why? Be cause Mike is the decision maker. So please don't give me this "given time", "working towards" and "process" crap.
     
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  14. AxelWolf

    AxelWolf Well-Known Member

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    And during that 4 months weren't you continuously saying and doing stuff that made it hard to figure shit out?
    I'm assuming you just kept digging the hole deeper. I'm not sure why the Mods or Mike didn't tell Norm to stop responding. Either way Norm seems to have caught a ton of flack over this and a majority of people dont seem to like him now because of this. I really think your fight is with him not Mike. He has said he handled it wrong big deal, no one is perfect, but dishonest and lack of integrity type comments are overstretching a bit, he's human just as you are. Glass houses, glass houses. Would you like it if people were going to bring up stuff you did wrong and mistakes every chance they get?

    Once again you are helping to drive wedges in the gambling community. It's reflecting bad on you more than the others at this point and the more you keep it up the worst you look. You will no longer been seen as the victim but as a bully and vindictive person who can't let stuff go. People are going to get sick of it, I dont know about you but I think most people wouldn't want to do business with someone that can't let something this insignificant go. I can only imagine if you thought something was more serious. I seems like this has been blown out of proportion.
     

  15. AxelWolf

    AxelWolf Well-Known Member

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  16. LovePotion9

    LovePotion9 Member

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    yeah Mike Shackleford aka Steve urkel is an innocent bystander................
    that's why there's almost 1500 posts in the other thread detailing what a dishonest, disingenuous person he is who has no integrity o_O
     
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  17. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

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    I agree. My fight was with Norm. Right up until Shackleford interjected himself in the middle. Qfit (Norm) returned to WoV on Dec 31, after a 5 year, 9 month absence, to dispute some things that I had said. That's fine. He had every right to do so. And he and I went back and forth for a while. But no rules were broken. There were no personal insults or I am sure I would have been suspended. Probably the worse thing that was said was that someone was lying. As a matter of fact, Mike's very first PM to me when he informed me of this truce, started out. "While no rules have been broken, we mods don't like it when...."

    So if no rules were broken and no insults made that rose to the level of suspension, why did Shackleford even involve himself? And the follow up question has to be would he have done so, if one of the parties wasn't his friend and requested him to intervene with this truce, that would limit what I could say?

    First this is only half the truth. He admitted privately to me that he handled it wrong. He hasn't said this publicly because then the question would be why am I still banned. And that is basically why he is furious that I shared PM's. Because it revealed something he said in private that he wasn't willing to say in public. I call that lying or being two-faced, or being dishonest....take your pick. That he was unwilling to state this publicly and fix it is what makes it a big deal. You don't say yeah, I did something wrong, but I am not going to fix it.

    Had he fixed, it, it would have been "no big deal". We could have all moved forward. I am still willing to.

    This is the second time you have stated this. I don't really understand what you are saying. I guess you, like Shackleford, would just like me to go away. Then I guess there would be no wedge in the gambling community?? So I am just supposed to go away, accept wrongful punishment. I lose the right of sharing my AP experiences as well as the enjoyment of participating in other topics, when I did nothing wrong. Again, the best analogy I can come up with is a judge telling the guy wrongfully imprisoned, "Yes, I know you are innocent, but I am not going to let you out". Maybe add a little "please stop fusing about being in jail, for the good of the community".[/QUOTE]
     
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  18. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

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    One other thing AxelWolf. Do you know why I am on this site? I am here because Mike Shackleford directed me here. I was not familiar with this site (even though I signed up a year ago, which I apparently forgot) until Shackleford told me there was a whole site dedicated to attacking him and maybe I should join them. That's a little weird right there.

    But why did me coming here and joining a thread that had been criticizing (or attacking) Mike for a year have any more effect? Why did my presents all of the sudden get any traction and as you say start driving a wedge in the community? I think the reason is because there are so many people in the community (at WoV) that know what happened. It's not just my word. They saw it first hand. And they would like answers.

    So anyway if you are looking to blame someone for driving a wedge, you might look to Shackleford on several fronts. Directing me here to make my case and not fixing the situation initially so there was no case to be made.
     
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  19. LovePotion9

    LovePotion9 Member

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    bingo! all these idiots keep criticizing you for posting here yet there boy Mike Shackleford aka Steve Urkel is the one who told you to do so!!

    LOL!!!! :D:D:D
     
  20. nate

    nate Well-Known Member

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    Wow, I have a hidden agenda? Just because I got sick of your ego bullshit in a very short time because I saw what you were? You're claiming you're the best thing since video poker to come to wov. I don't have any favoritism of either board. I don't even post on the wov board. But I do already see so many conflicted members there too. So they come here when banned and post to this "I am the great KewlJ board". You don't see it at all because megalomaniacs can't self regulate. And I guess you didn't catch one of my few early posts where I made the comment I think you are larry and freddie? So, actually I was channeling you through your alter ego larry. And you can take your puppy lovepotion and stick him up your ass as well.
    I stand with my contention you're a troubled ego tripping problem child. And your quick with the attack but then act like you don't attack people. Guess what dude... wov and this site are both surviving without your tremendous input. Get over yourself.
     

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