Baccarat Money Management concepts for Rustyshackleford

Having read and dabbled with a few of all the money management options you find on gambling sites, I deduced that they (most if not all) don't cut it for me.

I have on a few occasions busted a 144u bet using a Fibonacci, then having to perform a massive recovery, the other problem is obtaining the second win even when using the regress option. Win a 55u bet, drop back to 21u, a few losses and your betting 55u again, eventually you ain't gonna win that big bet, been there and lost those fuckin' hands 9-8.

The Labby doesn't work for me either, bets escalate (but not as fast as the fibo) then they stay there. Considering we can't predict a winning hand, who knows what can happen. I've lost more often using a Labby than a Fibonacci.

The D'Alembert, only increases by 1u after any loss, but once you run into a few losses, that needs to be balanced with a more wins than losses to get back to your comfort zone.

STAR is simply a delayed Fibonacci, then you have the Parlay options, sure-win, Z-method 31 system. Personally, if I'm losing xx units, I win a bet, I'm taking those chips off the table, I ain't Parlaying jack, I won't even repeat the last won bet, risking the prior win. Obviously I'm already under pressure, so I'm taking what I can.

The Rolls Royce of progressions the Marty or Grand Marty, again I've dabbled with it, more pressure using those than a Fibo and there are countless others, S Baily, Mongoose, Guetting, Koetsch G3M1, Lucas, and they go on and on and on. None of the long dead or living authors pay my bills, so I will bet what I want when i want.


From my own playing experience I concluded "bad runs" can happen at any time, and what I was doing was getting deep into a hole then having to perform these massive recoveries while hoping the same shit didn't occur again before I recouped my money.

So taking a step back, you have to identify a problem before you can look for a potential solution. Which I deduced was, unable to predict a result, therefore bets get too high after any series of losses. Rather than having to perform massive recoups, how about more frequent mini recoups.

Considering none of the negative progressions mentioned above achieve this, I stumbled across some old roulette system (I'll be damned if I can recall what it was, just spend 45 mins looking for it, but can't find it, might have been the Gracia method?). Anyway the author spoke about operating multiple banks, opening and closing branches, borrowing from one to pay another and so forth, basically spreading the load as required.

I also read over 10 years ago on the GG site posts from Victor (former owner of BS), who stated, the Labby is the most manipulative progression out there, he also mentioned about make it extremely difficult for the casino to take your money during losing runs, by reverting to betting the left hand side of unruly Labby strings, decreasing ones bets.


Suddenly a concept was born, don't get in to deep for those 4 or 5LIAR's. Manipulate bets to suit your own comfort zone. Pay the price of time, rather than risking your bankroll. Hence the creation of my "String Method", aptly named by a friend of mine after I showed it to him.

It all comes down to how you can handle your patience and composure after many hours at the tables, often I've walked away with 100% profit of a 60u buyin, having never placed a bet greater than 6u during the entire session. If you want to get somewhere fast, been at the tables too long, then that is what will trip you up.

No doubt my money management bears little resemblance to Garcia, HP Johnson, Perkins or a normal Labby, yet all these concepts have contributed to what is a propriety system. All stem from not wanting to get in too deep after say 4 or 5 losses in a row.

I've been playing this way now for many years, originally I started with strings of five digits 1-1-1-1-1, but found I didn't actually make 5 units once cleared due to B commission on some bets, so that increased to 6, and eventually 7.

I start off with 4 of these strings, and will create additional strings after any string is cleared, as it provides somewhere to absorb losses if the need arises. Suffice to say, you can't keep betting low forever. Next came a few years of trials and tribulations on manipulating those strings to keep bets within my no stress comfort zone.

I don't wish to go in the "ins and out's" of everything, just provide a broad concept. I've previously produced pages of "what if" examples, and people struggle to understand, maybe they need something spelt out in black and white, "how much do I bet next?", it's entirely up to you!! I've shown people one to one, it's too complex. But hey, you wanna win (or not lose) or do you just wanna gamble and take your chance with a 4 step Marty?

Somebody (Tomla) on another forum few years back posted, "you can never resolve your string, by constantly manipulating them". Yes while this is true, it doesn't matter, what matters is your chip stack, once you reach your goal and keeping your bets low, who cares about what was left written on your score card.

I will provide only one example, mainly to highlight what no author of any gambling monetary system will tell you, it also addresses your comment about needing 500 units playing with a Fibo (following progressions as written).


Let's say a pair of your Labby strings look like this.

3-3-4-4-5-5
2-2-2-2-2-3-3

You've had a rough time, lost a few bets, the last one being 5 units. Now following normal Labby principals you're suppose to bet 8u right? Left and right hand sides of the top Labby string, if you lose that bet, now what!!!

To hell with that, don't even go there, bet the lowest figure in your strings (slowly recoup the last few losses), therefore place a 2u bet. If you win that bet, don't give yourself a hard time, I should have bet 8u, you played it safe, we can't see round corners. But don't cross off a 2, rather reduce the largest figure which is 5 to a 3 (cross off the 5 and write a 3 on the left hand side). Once that top string is reduced to a comfort level bet size, then play a normal Labby.

If you lose the 2u bet, don't add it to those existing strings, rather create a new string of 7 x 1's and change two right most figures to 2's. The reason for creating an additional string of 7 x 1's as opposed to simply a single string of 2, is that I'm playing for profit, not just to recoup, the additional 1's will provide somewhere to absorb the next bet, if that is also lost. Anyway, assuming you lost that 2u bet, your strings would now look like this.

3-3-4-4-5-5
2-2-2-2-2-3-3
1-1-1-1-1-2-2

Now you can either repeat the 2u bet, or bet 3u (if you win 3u reduce one of those 5's to a 2), if your feeling totally deflated, bet 1u. Are you betting the Tie as a hedge bet? Run a separate string for those!!

I think bet selection does play it part somewhat, this goes hand in hand with my templates in another thread, 6 or 8 columns, the failure rate is pretty low, running this type of MM is ideal, because you can easily absorb 4L or even 6 or 8L, then you start recovering those losses, with the win "within a series of bets" methodology.

There is a lot more to it, such as running multiple value progression and the required ratio's between the lower and upper bets. But I don't want to drag this post out, rather just provide a broad concept and my recommendation to give what you read regarding the standard progressions a wide berth.

IMO, betting what you feel like without recording it's failure or success, relying on counting your chip stack simply won't cut it. Nosey people often say to me in the casino, "are you winning", I tell them, I've no idea, which I don't. I don't count my chips at all, all I focus on, are those strings and the clearance of them.

I feel like I've reveal way too much on a public board, but who cares, going from past experience, 99% will neither grasp the concept or have the patience or understanding to run with it. Bollocks to, I lose 5IAR and now I'm expected to bet 21u, get the fuck outta here Mr Fibonacci. I'll use you for extreme recovery purposes only.

 

Johno, the thing I like about your 'String idea' is that it makes you think about what you are doing as you go along.
Like you say, why follow some author's plan blindly which may not be suited to the way things are going at the table.

 

Timing is in fact everything. Nice and descriptive work. I'll bet I can teach reading randomness with no consequences.

 

Exactly, when Rusty posted that he would need 500 units to play a Fibo, I thought I would highlight other options which he isn't going to read about any gambling literature. Don't get me wrong, of all the "classic" progressions, the Fibonacci is by far my preferred choice, but only when the need arises.

I don't subscribe to timing, you the player have no idea when shit will happen, just like you can't predict when good times will occur. I'm talking of a very tight 4Liar, the loss strings need to be manageable when using any negative progression.

Mark if you wish to demonstrate your ability in reading randomness, could you do it in another thread, cheers...

 

Another brilliant explanation ... Personally I never bet more than 6 units in a Labby, I split strings, if necessary, to stay constantly in my comfort zone.

 

This is where it gets tricky. A few nice wins at lower level followed by 1 or 2 losses at a higher level can be really frustrating. At some point gonna have to get a real good series over a fairly lengthy number of bets to profit. Can take a long time particularly if only betting 10 hands or so a shoe.

 

"you can't keep betting low forever", I simply quoted what you told me (wink)

Hey if you have £5 on the table or £500, doesn't change your odds, I prefer to keep my money OFF the table by any means. Despite the bad shoes posted on BS. I know it will come good eventually. In order to suffer losses at the higher level, you first need to lose at the lower level a few times. But I wasn't running a dual prog'.

Just finished this afternoons session;

1st shoe - W12 L6 (off to a good start)
2nd shoe - W11 L7 (can't expect rainbows all the time)
3rd shoe - W10 L9
4th shoe - W14 L12 (frustration kicking in, trying to hit my target without playing another shoe, biggest bet throughout 9u).

Nice 40u profit.

 

Sometimes don’t you just feel like that losing streak is just around the corner? You all are correct in that we never know what’s going to be next. Because if we did, we’d all be millionaires at this!

Often times on a couple of losses, I will drop down to a 1-unit bet to prevent a long 4LIAR or 5LIAR from really kicking me in the face. The recovery is much less grueling and as you said JK, if you win a 1-unit bet, just reduce that outside right number down a unit and resume there.

 

Funny you say that, I often feel that way, usually it happens when I've upped the ante regarding bet amounts, Murphy's Law can be a bitch sometimes.

Yep, also I do not remove '1's from my string, what's the point?

If you start off with a string is 1-1-1-1-1-1-1 and you win your first four placed 1u bets, leave the string alone, think of it as additional profit, besides it is more beneficial to have those '1''s in the string as they give more scope to absorb losses later on. So never cancel '1''s. leave them be.

 

Thanks for posting, i finally got to read it all when i got home from work, so it is established to win one must vary his bets, 1-7 spread?
is wizard of odds a good baccarat engine to expect what i would find in a casino club?

my wife saw me win a 500$ winner on video poker in sands pa and asked me could i turn a 10$ bill into 500$ at blackjack? seeing how id only have one bet to make i said no, i don't hit royals or half royals all the time but 80% i do reach where i cash out my free play or more in cash and the 20% its a bad run of cards, but sands pa does have all day baccarat tables from a monitor live shoe that you can back bet on, so now i wonder if i can turn a 10$ or 20$ into 500$ or 1000$ and how many attempts with the 20$ bill will it take? obviously id like to duplicate the same pay out return
if thats possible, i always think about the road not traveled, i lost 100$ playing video poker and told my wife im going to play baccarat with my other 100$ she said cmon play VP i said fine...5minutes later 3 card royal and i wonder what if i played baccarat? would i have won? if so how much?
seems to me theres alot of money to be made in baccarat in a almost 50/50 game its the only table game that didn't burn me like roulette or blackjack, a 1-7 bet spread does seem to be a way to go and most gaming books recommend a 40 unit betting stake for a session, i'll give it a try on the baccarat engine

 

1-7 spread, I've never thought of it that way, while recommended if you're ultra disciplined, I do sometimes bet more than 7u.

You don't mention how many 10$ or 20$ bills you have, to make $500, flat betting, the answer is no. There is more to lose playing Baccarat than to win, there is no edge. 40 units is playing by the seat of your pants.

I don't know if you have read it, Mickey Crimm who no longer posts here, posted a brilliant explanation on how to get a real mathematical edge playing VP, look it up. Personally if I was you, I'll stick with VP...

 

No point. Just agreeing that those 1’s can actually be a session saver to avoid escalating bets. And still stay in the game longer to hopefully win. I like the additional profit.

 

JK - I think Mickey posted on here recently but you’re right he’s not here much anymore. I think VP is your best bet Rusty. If you can get anywhere near a full pay machine, you can do better than baccarat.

 

100%, Baccarat is a hard game for novices...

Suggest you go search Micky's thread....

 

That video poker aficionado requires a bankroll of $ 5,000.-- if he wants to win $ 500.-- at one session of Baccarat .


ND

 

i always looked at gambling as a 1:1 type of deal regardless of the payout of the game 4000 for 4000 credit for VP and 5$ for 5$ for baccarat, but no game will ever work itself out that way betting banker is a 98.98% return ? and min bets here are 5$ and max i think 5k or 25k$ its something high, i do see now if i spread my bets with a 40 unit roll 5$ chips thats not enough for a session but flat bet can last me a few hours but like everyone said you need to vary your bets to win back, when i try a 1,2,3 positive system on baccarat wizard site, i can't close out the third win to end the sequence a profit, 5$ 10$ and 15$ but the third bet i lose and im lucky to win 3 bets in a row one or two times in a shuffle thats why im thinking 1-3 spread will not cut it even if banker gets an extra card those players come out too often

 

Rusty ,


You have a lot to learn . You should reach your win goal of 10 or 20 % within 10 to 11 decisions . Set the loss limit to 25 % of BR.

Never, ever replay any net wins .



ND

 

how many units would you recommend for a 5hour session? most of my gambling books recommend 40unit for any table game

 

A 5 hour session is the wrong sort of question. When you visit a casino, you should have a set win goal in mind, whether you make that in 90 mins or 8 hours, doesn't matter.

You might be lucky to last 2 shoes with a 40u bankroll. How about 200 units so you can dig yourself out of trouble if the need arises, plus it is mentally comforting knowing you have the ammunition, even if it is never brought into play!

 

Rusty ,

Prepare yourself with 3 bankrolls of equal size for the purpose to win 2 out of 3 sessions.

However if you lose the first 2 sessions do not play a third session it was not your day .



ND