Okay. I'll put this under Baccarat because? No reason. Anybody who wants to talk JAE triggers can do so under his thread. Random definition is the main issue. Can mean a lot of things but if we consider it mathematically means patterns that are not predictable, no? I think that's what Turbo Genius is alluding to. So, IMO, the argument first becomes an issue of prediction rather than randomness. Like my friend Lani (great programmer) used to say, "Doesn't matter if the outcomes are random or not, show how to predict an outcome." (paraphrase). But we can still argue randomness and then predictability. So we got Gizmo, JAE, McVince (others at BTC) says they can and do predict outcomes. Well, apparently these are the best kept secrets in a world where secrets can rarely be kept! LMAO. How did I get the last 3,334 wagers placed with a 53.66% win?