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Roulette Roulette - Random - Predictable ?

Discussion in 'Roulette Forum' started by TurboGenius, Mar 10, 2015.

  1. TurboGenius

    TurboGenius Active Member Founding Member

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    Even in "Random" there are patterns that are reliable and can be used to aid the player.
    This is one thing the "system fans" and those who hate them can agree on, at least
    on the fact that "random" produces obvious patterns.
    The obvious argument in this is that "past spins don't influence future spins", etc.
    Each spin is independent from the last, etc. However this isn't the case when a group of
    spins are charted - and most of us know this already.
    So, here is data from actuals that I am going through while making this thread - it's always
    better that way so even I don't know what's going to happen (although in this case I do)

    Run = sets of 38 spins (American wheel)
    number of hits = the results of these 38 spins - how many numbers showed 1 time, 2 times, 3 times, etc.
    Simple.
    ============================================
    Run....number of hits
    0.....1.....2.....3.....4.....5.....6
    1.....13....15....7....3.....0.....0.....0 (13 #s didn't show, 15 showed once, 7 showed twice, etc)
    2.....16....9.....10...3....0.....0.....0
    3.....13....13....11...1....0.....0.....0
    4.....17....12....3....4....2.....0.....0
    5.....17.....10...7....3.....0.....1.....0
    6.....11.....19....5....3.....0.....0.....0
    7.....15.....13....6....3.....1.....0.....0
    8.....13.....15....7....3.....0.....0.....0
    9.....12.....16....8....2.....0.....0.....0
    10....11....19....6.....1.....1.....0.....0
    11....13....19....2.....1.....3.....0.....0
    12....16....9.....11.....1.....1.....0.....0
    13....14....13....8.....3.....0.....0.....0
    14....15....13....7.....2.....0.....1.....0
    15....10....21....4.....3.....0.....0.....0
    16....16....11.....6.....5.....0.....0.....0
    17....15.....9.....13....1.....0.....0.....0
    18....14....14....6.....4.....0.....0.....0
    19....12....16.....8.....2.....0.....0.....0
    20....14....13....8.....3.....0.....0.....0
    ========================
    20 Runs / 760 spins
    Number of times a number showed and average
    0 = 277 average = 13.85
    1 = 279 average = 13.95
    2 = 143 average = 7.15
    3 = 51 average = 2.55
    4 = 8 average = 0.4
    5 = 2 average = 0.1
    6 = n/a
    =====================
    totals avgs = 38 (so my math is ok lol)

    I'll round these for simplicity.
    0 shows = 14 #s
    1 show = 14 #s
    2 shows = 7 #s
    3 shows = 3 #s
    4 shows = 0 #s
    5 shows = 0 #s
    6 shows = 0 #s (etc)
    =======================
    Now, how to use this for future spins ?

    So we can expect on average :
    14 numbers to not show up in any future 38 spins.
    14 numbers to show once.
    7 numbers to show twice.
    3 numbers to show 3 times.

    If you're into "Law of Third" then you could say 1/3 of the numbers in 38 spins won't show
    (on average) so my 0 shows should say 12.6 and then rounded to 13 (I have 14).
    For the sake of this post I'll leave my data as is, it was taken from my own recorded actuals and
    if I continued on then it's possible that my "14" would drop to "13"

    There are a few ways to use this info, I'll get into that in posts below.
     
  2. TwoCatSam

    TwoCatSam Member Founding Member

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    Turbo

    Been a month since this thread opened. I would love to see the continuation of this explanation even though you might be pummeled with insults.

    Sam
     
  3. Jesper Svensson

    Jesper Svensson Member

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    I think a lot of players know and try to use it. I think this is the less controversial issue about how the numbers fall. The discussion is if we can get any gain using it. I think we can, and I have made methods which for long time had more than 50% of the time double 1000 chips.
    I use 1000 lost as stop, and double as target, and it has for hundreds of times worked to more than 50% of the trials.
    It may be possible to show, it is just a fluke, I am not sure, but I am OK to win some without know why, or be wrong, than lose and know why.
    This has been played an a single zero RNG. Today I had to spin 20 spins to get the first repeter, still the session went good.

    Try and compare for example playing the same bet, on an outside EC, and use an inside EC there we shft chips to the htting numbers.
    My figures show the latter gain more.
     
  4. TwoCatSam

    TwoCatSam Member Founding Member

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    So, when the 6 hits you bet the 6. Then the 23 hits and you bet both. The the 18 hits and you bet all three. And you keep on until you get your winner? This will add up to far more than an EC very quickly.

    Maybe that's not what you mean. Please elaborate.

    Sam
     
  5. Jesper Svensson

    Jesper Svensson Member

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    Sam!
    Instead of staking dollar on an EC like red, I put cents on straight up 18 numbers. Say you are at BV zero or any casino with stakes from cent to many dollars. If you want to play LOW.
    Bet the first 18 numbers( except zero), using 10 cents each (nine is more easy it saves the fingers due to coins change, less clicking). If you got a hit, count it as candidate for a repeter. Then reduce one cent from all unhit and add seventeen cents to the winning. You play allways 1.80 dollars, and stop when you think its OK gain. I am sure you test it and get to know it before you play real. A god repeting gain more than stay at the same as betting 1.80 every time on outside LOW. A step progression on repeters, and low numbers not hit will get lower bets, still the same size of all bets together. We can use it on 18 first fallen numbers as well, as there are 1000:s different EC inside. If we belive last cycles repeter will stay, we can use it, or if we think the last 18 numbers will repete, we can us them. It is possible to use it on dozen double streets as well. We put some cents on six different numbers, rather than one double street dollarbet. If the table has surrender, it may be better betting outside regarding EC.

    I use as you mentioned play straight up as the come, and use a bold progression. I go on until I am on (100+) plus, and count it as a bust if I should bet all numbers. This method is risky, if the busts comes to narrow (Which methods are not?). The progression is the same as Grand Martingale. We progress the hitting numbers only and just the last hit, all other stay as before.
    Grand Martingale is a stepp progression, but we want to exit before too many numbers are fallen a few repeters should do.
    If the repeters delay, it seldom harm, but if they come spread out, so the bets raise and we have difficult recovering. Pls use pennies!!!!!

    This can gain good, but also lose bad. I would be better on NOZero, if we can effort to risk 5-times the stakes.

    This methods use i cent, but it is not cent gambling, it is in fact dollar bets, and the cents are fractions.

    Good Luck!
    Jesper
     
  6. TwoCatSam

    TwoCatSam Member Founding Member

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  7. Jesper Svensson

    Jesper Svensson Member

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    Sam!

    The last using bold positive progression, on numbers can be used with a limited numbers as six to nine. The main is to get a few repeters hitting before we spent too many chips.

    Thanks I have somewhere clickers I got before. As the bet changes a lot, the clicker should be similar to a bot. Once I used a bot, but it suddenly did not work anymore.
     
  8. Fossell

    Fossell Active Member

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    Was this thread ever continued here or anywhere else?

    Was always interested in the Phi, golden ratio number that presents itself as shown in Turbos first post here.

    37/23 = 1.608 (almost the golden ratio).

    Something like 80% of runs produce 13/14 no shows and 23/24 unique numbers.

    It doesn't necessarily help everyones play but it is a mathematic constant in roulette (and nature).
     
  9. TurboGenius

    TurboGenius Active Member Founding Member

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    It looks like the thread died - probably my fault for not going on with my initial post of info.
    Is random predictable ? Absolutely.
    Is it 100% and without fail - no, sadly. But you can certainly (and easily) overcome the small house edge.
     
  10. Fossell

    Fossell Active Member

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    I'd be interested to know your thoughts and suggestions of how to use the law of third maths in play? (Forgive if me if this is the kind of stuff you posted over and over again over the years!?)

    From running simulators in the past I've learned that there is a constant quantity of numbers that show/don't show within a run.
    And after 4 runs (148 spins Euro) all numbers 'most' of the time have shown. Obviously the 'when they show' is always the catch.

    Within those 4 runs there are always several numbers that peak around 7 shows and beyond. Nothing unusual. Just a logical and natural occurrence when your overlapping 4 runs of 23 unique numbers.
     
  11. Rona

    Rona Member

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    This is a good topic.
    And yes I agree that the law of the third may hold the secret to winning at roulette.
    No, I don't mean there are any obvious ways to exploit it. But there is definitely something there.
     
  12. Fossell

    Fossell Active Member

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    Law of third holds true and can def be utilised in betting methods.
    Of course we can't predict the very next number or section based on previous or trending results but you can predict that results balance out and all (most) the numbers will show within 148 spins (4 cycles). The problem is always when and the betting method to apply.
     
  13. Rona

    Rona Member

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    Hey Turbo, give us some more :)
    This may very well be one of the most interesting topics about roulette in the forum.
     
  14. TurboGenius

    TurboGenius Active Member Founding Member

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    It is interesting. :)
    I think people should focus more on the stats and what they show, and how to use this info.
    For example -
    I sit down and there are 38 possible numbers that will show up - I have no idea which ones will show up,
    and the payout is 35:1. I can't possibly win here because my best guess is 1:38 to be right and the payout
    is 35:1
    Now, what happens when I place my bets on a number that has shown once - expecting it to show twice ?
    I don't have to guess from 38 possible outcomes anymore.
    As a matter of fact - to be simple - a number can't show twice unless it has shown once.
    A number can't show 3 times unless it has shown twice. etc for as long as you'd like.
    Something to think about and you'll find the answer.
     
    Rona and The judge like this.
  15. Sandra453

    Sandra453 Member

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    Very interesting. I actually read about Law of the Third but never implemented it in my play. I guess I should try.
     
  16. petespin

    petespin Member

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    there s something behind this law , i ve found out recently which is the best way to use this law of third , iam plus 20,000e in 100,000 spins.
     
  17. Fossell

    Fossell Active Member

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    I guess your referring back to you initial post here Turbo.
    In that one is closing down the numbers you need to choose from that are the repeaters for the future.
     
  18. Fossell

    Fossell Active Member

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    Interesting Pete. Methods?
     
  19. petespin

    petespin Member

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    outside bets , double streets, single dozen, quads, 3 different methods and work all of them!
     
  20. Fossell

    Fossell Active Member

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    Bu
    But how do you play those bets Pete? Using law of third?
     

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