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Baccarat "THE DIRTY DOZEN" as promised.

Discussion in 'Baccarat Forum' started by God Player, Jan 9, 2019.

  1. God Player

    God Player New Member

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    Hi everyone,
    I am new to this forum. I posted earlier today and as promised I am providing my system for all. For a little understanding of why, all I ask is everyone please read my previous post "Yes I believe Jesus is helping me in a very unique manner and am told to share...."


    and then we will get into the method of play I have put together. Thank you in advance.

    Now onto the my method....

    I call this method as our target will be to win 12 units per shoe. There are some rules to follow and be disciplined in but they should be fairly easy if you draw a good plan out.

    For simplicity sake, I will be using $25 units. There will be 3 main sections to this method....

    1. Bet placement
    2. Betting strategy
    3. Bankroll


    But first off, let's be clear what our target is. The target is to win 12 units per shoe. In additional, our target will be to play 5 shoes, this is up to you but realistically I think winning 60 units a day as out target is reasonable but of you have the time you could be making more if you have the time to grind things out over a long period of time. I find it on average to go through about 5 shoes in about 3 hours. So, let's begin.....

    1. BET PLACEMENT

    To work this system you will need to use a score card and the results of the PREVIOUS shoe. You can copy the results from the previous shoe if possible or you may need to just sit and record the ENTIRE last shoe before playing. So once again, you need the history of the previous shoe PRIOR to starting to bet.

    NOTE: WE DO NOT BET TIES AT ALL! Meaning is the previous shoe was a tie in the play we simply sit the hand out.

    Also, you will record the plays going vertically in 1 single column of the scorecard. I am providing live results from shoes I have recorded. Here is what our first shoe (Previous to before we start playing)...
    we will work with ....

    B
    P
    B
    B
    B
    ---
    B
    B
    B
    P
    B
    ---
    P
    P
    B
    P
    B
    ---
    P
    B
    B
    P
    B
    ---
    P
    B
    P
    P
    T
    ---
    P
    B
    B
    B
    P
    ---
    P
    P
    P
    B
    P
    ---
    B
    B
    P
    B
    P
    ---
    B
    B
    B
    P
    B
    ---
    B
    B
    B
    P
    T
    ---
    P
    B
    B
    B
    P
    ---
    P
    B
    P
    P
    B
    ---
    P
    P
    B
    B
    T
    ---
    T
    P



    - As you can see we make a separator every 5 results for ease of viewing.
    - Once we have this history we will begin to play on the start of the next shoe.
    - Now the goal of our bet placement strategy is to be the OPPOSITE of the previous result in that same position from the previous shoe.

    Bet 1: The previous shoe the result was a Banker, therefore we will bet PLAYER.
    Bet 2: The previous shoe the result was a Player, therefore we will be BANKER.
    Bet 3: The previous shoe the result was a Banker, therefore we will bet PLAYER.
    Bet 4: The previous shoe the result was a Banker, therefore we will bet PLAYER.
    Bet 5: The previous shoe the result was a Banker, therefore we will bet PLAYER.
    ----
    Bet 6: The previous shoe the result was a Banker, therefore we will bet PLAYER.
    Bet 7: The previous shoe the result was a Banker, therefore we will bet PLAYER.
    Bet 8: The previous shoe the result was a Banker, therefore we will bet PLAYER.
    Bet 9: The previous shoe the result was a Player, therefore we will bet BANKER.
    Bet 10: The previous shoe the result was a Player, therefore we will bet BANKER.
    ---
    ...and so forth......

    So remember, we are looking to place our bet OPPOSITE of what the previous result the show PRIOR to the one we are playing.
    If the previous shoe, the result was a TIE, we simply sit that hand out and play the next hand.

    That is all we are doing on bet placement. Very simple.

    So in this example the result of our shoe will be as such...

    B P - Win
    P P - Loss
    B P - Win
    B B - Loss
    B B - Loss
    -----
    B T - TIE
    B P - Win
    B P - Win
    P B - Win
    B P - Win
    -----
    P B - Win
    P B - Win
    B P - Win
    P P - Loss
    B B - Loss
    -----
    P B - Win
    B B - Loss
    B P - Win
    P P - Loss
    B P - Win
    -----
    P B - Win
    B P - Win
    P B - Win
    P T - TIE
    T B - SKIP (Tie)
    -----
    P P - Loss
    B T - TIE
    B P - Win
    B B - Loss
    P P - Loss
    -----
    P B - Win
    P P - Loss
    P T - TIE
    B B - Loss
    P B - Win
    -----
    B P - Win
    B P - Win
    P P - Loss
    B P - Win
    P P - Loss
    -----
    B P - Win
    B B - Loss
    B P - Win
    P B - Win
    B B - Loss
    -----
    B B - Loss
    B B - Loss
    B B - Loss
    P B - Loss
    T B - SKIP (Tie)
    -----
    P P - Loss
    B B - Loss
    B B - Loss
    B T - TIE
    P P - Loss
    -----
    P P - Loss
    B B - Loss
    P P - Loss
    P P - Loss
    B B - Loss
    -----
    P B - Win
    P P - Loss
    B B - Loss
    B B - Loss (end shoe)
    T
    -----
    T
    P


    DON'T WORRY... we expect to have many times the result is the same as from the previous shoe. This will be resolved in Part 2 (Betting Strategy).


    2. BETTING STRATEGY

    Now the most important out of this I feel is the money management. Yes, we will be using a small grand martingale system! Don't be scared we are only doing 3 steps!

    Our betting strategy will be to bet 1 unit, if we win we repeat 1 unit.....
    If we lose the first bet, we next bet 3 units.....
    If we lose the second bet, we bet 7 units....

    The progression is 1-3-7.....

    - On any win we go back to betting 1 unit.
    - After 3 consecutive loss, we go back to 1 unit

    Note, we will expect there are times that we will lose 3 consecutive losses with a max loss for those three bets be 11 units. In fact, we may even lose 6 hands in a row losing 22 units. DONT WORRY! This is expected.

    That is it! Using the betting strategy above and the bet selection from part 1, you will be in the positive or at work a loss of 5-7 units for the entire shoe.

    However..!!...!!!.... let us be reminded that the name of this method is "DIRTY DOZEN".
    Our GOAL is to win 12 units per shoe.
    IMPORTANT: Once you hit 12 units profit in the shoe.....STOP. If you continue to play the shoe... you either can win much more OR lose it all back and be in the negative. So this is very important that you stick to this limit of 12 or even 8-10 units profit depending on your target. Whatever it is... make sure you stick to that and don't get greedy! Remember, we will be playing 5 shoes.

    I also notice that close to the end of the shoe and I am only up 8-10 units I will stop it there and wait for the next shoe.

    Important! Even if you have reached the 12 unit target (or target you set), stop paying but you will need to continue recording the results as you will need it to play the next shoe.

    3. BANKROLL

    Ok this is a bit tricky. From my calculations ...

    The optimal bankroll to use this system is 132 units. The actual bankroll is actually much less but I like to play it safe. I explain why the optimal bankroll is 132 units as such: note that I am placing $25 units.

    I split the mentality of the bankroll into 2 types as follows:

    1. We expect that we will have 3 even 6 consecutive losses. Each series of loss is 3 consecutive loses totaling 11 units losses. We will generously allow ourselves of having 7 loss series in a shoe. Once again, I am being generous as most of the time I only see 4-5 loss series in a shoe, but we will expect up to 7 series we lose. So 7 series of losses at 11 units per series is 77 units ($25 units) = $1,925. This is what we expect to lose in the shoe if it gets a really bad shoe. I honestly rarely see this happen but you have to be cautious and we will not be caught by surprise!

    2. Now minus those 77 units I expect to still bet 55 units throughout the shoe thus being $1,375. Yes I will never use it up in 1 shoe but lets just be generous.
    $1,925 + $1,375 = $3,300 Bankroll or ...132 units!

    REMEMBER.... we are looking to make a 10-12 unit profit per shoe! I found that most of the time, I hit this target within the first 20-30 hands played.

    CAVEAT:
    I have also noticed that FLAT BETTING is possible with this strategy with the most loss per shoe around 7-9 units....and wins of about 7-15 units.....it varys.


    So that's what I have on this first post of this system. I have ran it again the results provided by wizrdofodds and I am very impressed.

    So in summary....
    It you manage to win 12 units per shoe.... play 5 shoes a day.... that 60 units in profit per day.
    Roughly calculated to be (because of commissions).....

    $10 units = $600 per day
    $25 units = $1500 per day

    That's all ... I do look forward to your inputs... just please remember read my previous post first and also use the honor system and PAY IT FORWARD.

    Thanks all!

    P.S. Sorry this is my first post on these type of forums and I am a really bad writer...
     
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  2. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    You went into a swarm of losses. Did you see that? If you played a minimum sized bet during the losing swarm and much higher bets during all other play you would do better. I've been told by a Christian multi-millionaire to bet at the lowest possible, table minimum, when you can't see the good stretches, and at least 20 times more in the good patches. In your case it could be $5, $15, $35 and $25, $75, $175 to make up a manageable bankroll. That's just 5 times more but you would recover from that swarm much faster.

    I would also add to that the business model of only taking what you really need.

    I will research your findings on my own. I can power test this using my own bet selection methods. Any consistent bet selection process will produce the kinds of results that you have shown. In my opinion sticking to the one that is currently working makes the best sense. I have many methods for bet selection running at the same time. So I can move off of bad streaks. Hope that makes you think about what you shared so far.
     
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  3. God Player

    God Player New Member

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    Thank you for the input. Yes I agree with you! However, before hitting the losing streak I had already stopped betting as the target per shoe was 12 units. But i do hope you test this and if possible let me know. Thank you in advance. Cheers
     
  4. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    OK, I did a very quick test where I read randomness to do bet selections and then switch to blind betting without guessing:

    So I used $5 X 18 numbers, $15 X 18 numbers and $35 X 18 numbers if needed. I used my EC practicing software. You can see me change bet selections based on reading trends. Then you can see me just stick to one same bet selection.

    Code:
     W | B  R | O  E | L  H | 0  6 | P | S |  --  SN  --  SP 
     nb|    X |    X |    X |    X |   |   |  --  01  --  34 
     nb| X    |    X |    X | X    | X |   |  --  02  --  28 
     nb|--------------------| X    | X | X |  --  03  --  37 
     nb| X    | X    |    X | X    |   |   |  --  04  --  29 
     nb| X    | X    | X    |    X |   | X |  --  05  --  15 
     nb|    X | X    |    X | X    |   | X |  --  06  --  25 
     nb| X    |    X |    X | X    | X |   |  --  07  --  28 
     nb|    X | X    |    X |    X |   |   |  --  08  --  19 
     nb| X    | X    |    X |    X | X | X |  --  09  --  31 
     nb|    X | X    | X    | X    | X |   |  --  10  --  01 
       |    X |    X |    X | X    |   |   |  --  11  --  36 ( $ -90 ) Odd
     X |    X |    X | X    |    X |   |   |  --  12  --  16 ( $ 150 ) Not Specials
       | X    |    X | X    |    X | X |   |  --  13  --  06 ( $ 60 ) Red
       | X    |    X |    X |    X |   | X |  --  14  --  22 ( $ -210 ) Red
     X |    X | X    | X    | X    | X |   |  --  15  --  01 ( $ 420 ) Red
       | X    | X    |    X | X    |   | X |  --  16  --  35 ( $ 330 ) Red
     X | X    | X    |    X | X    |   | X |  --  17  --  35 ( $ 600 ) Black
       | X    | X    | X    |    X |   | X |  --  18  --  15 ( $ 515 ) Primes
     X |    X | X    |    X | X    | X |   |  --  19  --  27 ( $ 800 ) Primes
       | X    |    X |    X | X    | X |   |  --  20  --  28 ( $ 710 ) Odd
     X |    X |    X | X    |    X |   |   |  --  21  --  16 ( $ 980 ) Even
       |    X | X    | X    |    X | X |   |  --  22  --  03 ( $ 890 ) Black
     X | X    |    X |    X | X    |   |   |  --  23  --  26 ( $ 1130 ) Not Specials
     X |    X | X    |    X | X    | X |   |  --  24  --  27 ( $ 1210 ) Not Specials
       |    X |    X | X    |    X | X | X |  --  25  --  12 ( $ 1110 ) Not Specials
       |    X |    X | X    | X    |   |   |  --  26  --  14 ( $ 840 ) Black
     X |    X | X    |    X | X    | X |   |  --  27  --  27 ( $ 1470 ) Red
       | X    |    X | X    | X    |   | X |  --  28  --  10 ( $ 1370 ) Not Specials
       | X    | X    |    X |    X | X | X |  --  29  --  31 ( $ 1070 ) Not Specials
       | X    |    X |    X |    X |   | X |  --  30  --  22 ( $ 370 ) Not Specials
     X |    X |    X | X    | X    |   |   |  --  31  --  14 ( $ 450 ) Not Specials
       |    X |    X | X    |    X | X | X |  --  32  --  12 ( $ 350 ) Not Specials
       | X    | X    | X    | X    |   | X |  --  33  --  13 ( $ 50 ) Not Specials
     X | X    |    X | X    |    X | X |   |  --  34  --  04 ( $ 610 ) Not Specials
    
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
  5. cps10

    cps10 Member

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    Interesting. I would be willing to do a TBL bet selection and you would likely get similar results.
     
  6. Glawour

    Glawour New Member

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    Hi,
    Giz i think roulette and baccarat have different outcomes when it comes to random...
    So your result is not related with his system...i just throw an opinion, correct me if i am wrong...
    Yet still you got nice results as well...
    As per God system i will give it a try , sounds interesting and easy to put it in practice.
    Thanks God, i will come back later with results...
     
    God Player likes this.
  7. Craps

    Craps Active Member

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    God Player,
    I like your approach because its all structured. However , you played too many hands. No good. In addition your Grand Martingle is too short. The most ideal one is the normal 5 steps Martingle which is 1.2.4.8.16.
    12 units per shoe is too much. 2 would be reachable with ease. By the way 5 shoes is more than 3 hrs in a brick and mortar casino.
    I don't like your bet selection either. You could lose 12 in a row. Never use a template. Bet selection should be decided on what you chart.
    Read all my post cos' I am making good side income from a 5 step Martingle.
    My win is 8 units per session (4 shoes ). Until today my average win is $50 on 1 session playing a $25 unit bet after deducting losses which is unavoidable.
    You should never approach with a "money printing" mentality. You should "steal" with a hit-and- run approach.

    What's your STOP LOSS?
     
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  8. Glawour

    Glawour New Member

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    Nice touch, good ideas.
    PS: at 25$ per unit to do 5 steps Mart is a bit risky, or more, hopefully you will not reach number 5...
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
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  9. Craps

    Craps Active Member

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    Glawour,
    Tell my something honestly. No matter what money management you use be it Flat Betting, Martingle, Paroli, Fibonacci, D'alembert, Labouchere or some cluster progression like 111222333, 1324, 122 on a losing day, is 31 units too much?
    A 5 step Martingle have a probability of winning a bet at 98.69% (31 out of 32) As long as you don't abuse it, the risk is low. I am not saying it won't lose but to lose it you need to have bad luck. If you follow my approach, you should win 5.5 times before losing 1. Mind you each time is 8 units profit. Furthermore you will only lose 31 units if failed on the very first try. If you make 4 units and then failed, your loss is only 27 units.
     
  10. Glawour

    Glawour New Member

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    Depends on everyone's wallets. Your point is not wrong.
    You can do a Mart even higher if the casino let's you and your bankroll for a higher precision of win. (Mart. strategy is a highly risky one no matter what, do not forget)
    I just said in case of someone who tries to make some extra cash and not trying to get rich in one day.
    Just to make sure everyone is on the same page: in online casinos they use two shoes make sure if someone is testing this system to wait two shoes untill they can get starting...
     
  11. Glawour

    Glawour New Member

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    •As a target myself i would stop at 2 units/shoe for a guaranteed hit (this is my strategy always)
    •I will test this tonight with 3 Mart. steps and 5 steps as well to see who will bust or who will give me the target faster and report it here.
    •Stop loss should be definitely two sessions failed per shoe.
     
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  12. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    Baccarat is basically an Even Chance game. It has a smaller house edge than the double zero Roulette, which is what I tested. I was using the 18 numbered sized bets. You can use Craps if you know how. It's all basically the same. For me to use it at a real Indian Casino, out here in the west, I would have to use $5, $15, and $25 as the three steps because they only allow a maximum bet of $25 strait up on any inside bet number. It's an interesting method as I rarely get three losses in a row. The idea of getting one unit for each spin while you are winning means that all you need is 11 wins for each lost progression. So the real game is simple. You need to know best when to apply those three steps. They don't have to be consecutively. And balance occurs when you win at least 11 spins / hands before a loss occurred. It sure is a lot faster to reach a three net win goal and done method if you get lucky. Three wins and out would be $270. I'm not nearly done testing this. I will know if it is worth it based on my skill at reading trends. Of course if you play it blind then it will lose mathematically.
     
  13. Craps

    Craps Active Member

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    I hate it when Martingle is discussed, people always goes to the table limit point. I am talking about a 5 step Marty. The one that is not easy to bust and the losses are manageable. Furthermore I totally oppose to anyone using Marty continously. The charting and hit and run is the key, my friend.
     
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  14. Nathan Detroit

    Nathan Detroit Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    Gizmotron ,


    Stay with roulette EC. More transparency . I am only playing Baccarat in between my 2 out of 3 roulette sessions . The same also applies to Baccarat winning 2 out of 3 sessions .


    For Baccarat I have chosen then the 2-1-2 method at the present tome . Ditto for EC .


    I am more comfortable with 2-1-2 than with the 2-1-2-3-3-5-2 up and pull MM system .



    ND
     

  15. cps10

    cps10 Member

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    Thank you to you “God” for your post. I like your willingness to post your method for us to try. I tested it the way that you suggested and played 11 shoes. It lost 46 units total and was for a total of 502 decisions. I then played the opposite and it lost only 6 units total and only 346 decisions. I also like the Grand Martingale and I believe that three steps is enough to know if you can win or not. I have written a strategy that I have a played over the years which could perhaps utilize this money management and perhaps I will test against that although I use a different MM and win consistently.

    The bet selection utilized the basic math and facts of baccarat. We all know that approximately 50% of all patterns will be a 1R. We know that 25% of all patterns will be a 2R. And we also know that 12.5% are a 3R. Use the Grand Marty with that kind of bet selection. Now to use only three steps, you could bet for a 1R or a 2R or 3R for your entire Marty. Seven out of eight sequences on average are going to win for you. The eighth one loses you 11 units. Hopefully the seven that win will more than cover your one loss. On average you should have 4 wins at 1 unit; 2 wins at 2 units and 1 win at 3 units which would be 11 units. However with commissions you could have difficulties so you would need to set strict stop win limits. And if you continued and busted out, you would need to wait out a 4R or higher before you start betting again. You could also maybe just bet two in the sequence and use the 7-unit bet for the next opportunity. In other words, bet the 1-unit and 3-unit and if it loses to a 3R or better, again, just wait it out.

    Another possibility is to stretch it out to four steps and do two bets and two bets at 1-3-7-15 for 26 units total. There are plenty of great possibilities here. Thank you “God” for the topic.

    In the past, a partner and I would utilize a five-step GM and did well. But it did get ugly at some times ha!

    Giz - I have also written a roulette strategy that utilizes something similar in using all three EC attributes. The MM there is a little more flat, but maybe a Grand Marty would be fun to test.
     
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  16. Craps

    Craps Active Member

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    Glawour,
    Again you demonstrate that you are so naive on odds. Everything you do in Baccarat the odds is 50/50 or even with house edge. A Martingle is 50/50 too. The only difference is probability of winning. A 5 step Marty needs 31 wins to cover one loss, but the chance of winning is 31 out of 32. Therefore its no different from Flat Betting.
     
  17. God Player

    God Player New Member

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    I agree that a 5 step is much better..however my concern is the BR. Thats why i structured it to stop at 3. My stop loss is if I win 10-12 units I stop with the profits and wait till the next shoe. Normally if i am am.down 10 units i stop and just chalk it as a loss shoe and will make it up on the next shoe.

    Also, I will sometimes watch the results of the prev shoe and see that it loss 4 times... I bet again as it is rarely I see that 4 losses are side by side.
     
  18. God Player

    God Player New Member

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    I am in agreement with you here as well. Good luck and pleaae let me know how it goes.
     
  19. blulu

    blulu New Member

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  20. Craps

    Craps Active Member

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    From my very honest experiences, I have come to a conclusion that you either win and hit your target or lose and go home. That to me is the ultimate pro Baccarat player. I don't believe in comebacks. It is the single thing that destroys most players. If my 5 step Marty goes bust, I 'ii go home. For you if you are down twice, you will be off 22 units, then what?. You will have to grind your way back. Remember there are "bad days". No matter what you do , your losses just pile up. You have to take care of losses. Period.
    IN addition, learn charting, don't use a template.
     
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