1. Welcome to the #1 Gambling Community with the best minds across the entire gambling spectrum. REGISTER NOW!
  2. Have a gambling question?

    Post it here and our gambling experts will answer it!
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Discussions in this section are assumed to be EV- as they are outside of the Advantage Play section. For EV+ discussions, please visit the Advantage Play section.
    Dismiss Notice

Misc WizardOfVegas Forum is Dying

Discussion in 'Miscellaneous Gambling Forum' started by LovePotion9, Sep 5, 2015.

This is a Designated Unrestricted Area and is moderated more lightly and may therefore contain more offensive language. Reader beware.
  1. LarryS

    LarryS Compulsive Liar Compulsive Liar

    Joined:
    May 8, 2015
    Likes:
    1,830
    I didnt realize there was a code of conduct that came along in the box with the metal detector.
     
    beachedwhale likes this.
  2. LarryS

    LarryS Compulsive Liar Compulsive Liar

    Joined:
    May 8, 2015
    Likes:
    1,830
    I tend to agree with the [pompous people who judge other peoples "fun"
    Its like talking to someone who talks about how they love to go on cruises......and after they tell you how much they pay for those cryuises...someone chimes in and laughs at them telling them whay the fuck are you paying when you can get a job on the cruise line busing tables, and get room and board and alot of wonderful ocean views for free.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
    beachedwhale likes this.
  3. LarryS

    LarryS Compulsive Liar Compulsive Liar

    Joined:
    May 8, 2015
    Likes:
    1,830
    to clarify, i agree..that they are labeled as pompous....not for their actions
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
    beachedwhale likes this.
  4. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Likes:
    1,072
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    MOST AP's do NOT write books and articles. MOST AP's you have never heard of. They go about their business unknown to both you and I. And from a pure view pint of self interest, every AP should probably follow that lead, including little if any participation of public message boards. o_O But people, including AP's are all different.

    I do want to point out that publishing on the topic of AP is not always about profit. AP is a very narrow, specific target audience and thus, limited profit margins. If you are motivated by profit, I would hope you pick a topic that appeals to more than a fraction of 1 percent of the population. :eek: And for some of us, it isn't about profit at all. Earlier this year, I signed an agreement to publish a book with a leading "gambling" publisher here in Las Vegas. In an effort to keep the cover price as low as possible, I waived any profit that I would get from the project. And a couple months ago, I backed out of the project altogether, when I realized my real motivation was misplaced (which had to do with having a platform for my side of events that have occurred in the community). Breaking the contract cost me an "exit fee", so it isn't about money and profit for all who write books or articles. So, if I decide to share my experiences in a book at a later date, more towards the end of my career (if there is still interest) as intentionally planned, I will be lucky to recover my expenses. So it isn't always about money. :rolleyes:

    Blackhole, It is not my intent to argue with you over the existence of AP's or not. It is your right to not believe in AP's if you wish. Just like it is your right to believe the earth is flat if you wish. ;) No skin off my nose. But, I have one question for you. If AP and all those, including myself claiming to be AP's are frauds, why does the casino industry spend a small fortune and so much time and effort on countermeasures, including all the consultant fees paid the various consulting people/firms, technology like facial recognition, and all the bad publicity that goes along with it, including occasional lawsuits from casino personnel occasionally stepping over the line and roughing up AP's?

    In the case of blackjack, the casino industry throws away huge amounts of money of continuous shuffle machines (CMS), which must be leased on a monthly basis. Cost analysis shows the reoccurring monthly cost plus the high maintenance costs for these machines that frequently break down, far outweigh the advantage gained by less shuffling, so THAT is not the incentive. If it was just about less shuffling down time, the industry standard would be the less costly automatic shuffle machine (ASM), but it isn't. There would be no need for the more costly CSM, who's main "selling point" is that it eliminates the possibility of card counters, shuffle trackers and various other tracking techniques.

    But again, you are free to believe what you like. Tell the Easter Bunny I said "hello". :D
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
    beachedwhale likes this.
  5. redietz

    redietz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2016
    Likes:
    335
    Location:
    Tennessee
    Blackhole, I'm having trouble finding any quote on here where I refer to myself as "an AP." Perhaps you could help me out.

    Or is this the same logic you bring to bear by assuming, because I criticize Trump, that I must be a Clinton supporter or a "libtard?" But then you couldn't find a single post where I said anything positive about Clinton (I may have said she was "sane;" not sure if that counts).

    You just spout stuff with no basis.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
    beachedwhale likes this.
  6. MrV

    MrV Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2016
    Likes:
    652
    Occupation:
    attorney at law (retired)
    Location:
    Portland, Oregon
    Good grief.

    Do you seriously think there is a large audience who would be receptive to your tales of mistreatment by Norm and the Wiz?

    I'm not saying you shouldn't talk about it; I am saying a receptive audience would be very limited.

    Heck, you've already said all that needs to be said, on these boards.

    What other tales from the"AP Community" have you to relate?

    Dole them out here and let us opine whether a wider audience might enjoy reading about them.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
    beachedwhale likes this.
  7. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Likes:
    1,072
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Agreed. I have said my piece (for several months) and although I continue to be disappointed and hurt by treatment by Wiz, and just flabbergasted by treatment from Norm, I have moved on.

    Perhaps you missed the part were I stated "I realized my real motivation was misplaced". ;)


    I have often been told that my story is of interest.

    Quitting my job at age 20 (had Id that said 21) to pursue a career card counting. I knew nothing of other AP and really very little about card counting (far les than I thought I knewo_O). Early years of barley a five figure income, lots of sandwiches, riding the 'casino bonus' buses to Atlantic City for free transportation). A couple mildly better years in AC earnings-wise, but wearing out my welcome. In my mid 20's, relocating 2500 miles from friend/family to Las Vegas, where I knew no one, buying a highrise condo and living a block off the strip. Learning all along the way from my own experiences as well as from folks on message boards sharing their experiences (and knowledge) to where I am today, owning my own home in suburban Vegas making a comfortable living. Not a rags to riches story....I was never in rags and am no where near rich. Not the high-rolling, high end, Vegas suites story that some of the various team members have shared. Just an old fashioned card counter grinder, slowly move-up the ladder story.

    I don't know if it is of interest (and to how many) or not. o_O I'll mark you down as a "no". ;)
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
    beachedwhale likes this.

  8. freddy

    freddy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2015
    Likes:
    2,014
    KewlJ, you are one of the few *cough* APs that I am inclined to believe. Most only talk (brag) about their wins while you bare all...the good the bad and the ugly. I might be inclined to believe Mickey but who cares? He's fun to have around.

    Have you ever thought about going on Dancer's show? I remember listening to a blackjack player on there making some pretty lofty claims. Wouldn't it be fun to have you both on at once?

    Also, do you ever worry about being found out by the casinos due to all your posting?
     
    beachedwhale likes this.
  9. LarryS

    LarryS Compulsive Liar Compulsive Liar

    Joined:
    May 8, 2015
    Likes:
    1,830
    oops, above i [put a link that i was saving for a patrick thread..sorry...doesnt belong
     
    beachedwhale likes this.
  10. KewlJ

    KewlJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Likes:
    1,072
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Munchkin invited me to do the show several times. Obviously I declined. That was a couple years ago, before some of the recent blackjack guys that they have had on. I am not a great communicator, speaking as well as written word, which probably is very evident. I sometimes have a hard time finding the right words to express myself and get my point across.

    One of the BJ guys making lofty claims was a guy who goes by the handle smallcapgrowth who was on the show about a year ago, IIRC. SCG, who I know fro other sites, is a slash and burn type player. He plays large amounts, and plays aggressively. He isn't worried about longevity. He burns a place out and moves on to the next, moving around the country and world. Obviously he is of the "slaughter" camp, where as I am of the "shearer" camp, with longevity as my top priority and returning again and again to play the same locations. I know several guys like SCG that have done real well like several hundred thousand a year for a year or two until they burn out everywhere. That's fine if that is your goal, but I think that kind of strategy, "burn and slash" is becoming harder and harder to pull off for long with advances in player tracking technology.

    Not as worried as I probably should be. :rolleyes: I don't know, I haven't had much trouble from posting. There was a much publisized robbery outside my residence the year after I moved to Vegas, that I know was connected to posting because of something the gunman said. He got some money, not all that I had on me that day. Most of the damage from that incident (and aftermath) was damage to my reputation. Of course that had nothing to do with a casino, which is what you asked about. But it is an example of what can happen from careless posting of info. :(

    As far as casino issues, I have had two minor incidents that come to mind. Two people in a casino have called me by my online handle. One was a pit person at a casino in my regular rotation. I didn't respond....didn't even look at or acknowledge that I heard him and he walked away. Second was similar, male approached and called me by my online handle. Not sure if he was casino personnel or perhaps fellow AP. Again, ignored him an he moved on.

    My whole game, my whole approach since moving to Vegas has been with the priority of longevity. I want to play for a few more years. So I focus on levels of play that the casino I am playing is comfortable with and are better tolerated. This has worked well for me so far. So, I am probably not of the level that too many casino, surveillance network personnel are spending too much time trying to figure out. I am just not that big a threat.

    But I do try to be careful. I try to talk in generalities. And when I do mention a specific incident that I think might be of interest, I try to let some time pass, sometimes days, sometimes weeks, so as not to identify myself by that incident.

    Probably the one time it should have created a big problem, but I got lucky and it didn't was about 5 years ago when I posted in detail about a monster day that I had. the post was entitled "the perfect shoe", and it damn near was. In that one 15 minute shoe, playing mostly heads up with the dealer, I think I pushed two hands and won the rest, all at max bet and what I call supermax bet (reserved for very infrequent special occasions when my cover has been blown anyway). In that 15 minutes, I made what turned out to be a third of my years total win. I was nervous just getting out of the casino (didn't cash out) and was so excited about this massive win, still the biggest single day win, I have recorded, that I didn't let much time pass before posting about it. That was just stupid, but it didn't end up costing me anything.

    But, yes, because I am sometimes an idiot, I post things that I later read, or one of my networking friends looking out for me, emails me and says "hey you shouldn't have posted that and I go back and delete it. Unfortunately on this site, you have all of 5 minutes to make that decision before it becomes permanent record. :eek:
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2016
    beachedwhale likes this.
  11. nate

    nate Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2016
    Likes:
    361
    Location:
    united states
    Kind of like the code of conduct you're seriously lacking.
     
    beachedwhale likes this.
  12. Mickey Crimm

    Mickey Crimm Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2015
    Likes:
    746
    Yeah, that. Because those of us who have the skills to do it are just going to rock on. Those that don't have the skills are going to bitch and complain, like Larry. He can't do, to compensate for his inability he has to lash out at those that do.

    Larry is an old reminder that no matter how good you do there is a sourpuss that doesn't like it.

    There will always be a loser Larry to bitch and complain in every generation.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2016
    beachedwhale and AxelWolf like this.
  13. redietz

    redietz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2016
    Likes:
    335
    Location:
    Tennessee
    LarryS likes to paraphrase what others have said, then point out the problems with what's been said using the convenience of his own paraphrasing. It's self-serving, weak, and would be ridden out on the rails (pardon the expression, Mickey) in any academic debate or serious piece of rhetoric or writing.

    He does this over and over, as in the two examples listed above, and as Mickey has pointed out on previous occasions. It gets old, it's obvious, and it's flat-out weak. He'd fail rhetoric 101 or journalism 101 writing garbage like this.
     
    beachedwhale likes this.
  14. AxelWolf

    AxelWolf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2016
    Likes:
    463
    Occupation:
    Guess
    Location:
    Las Vegaas
    I have always wanted to do this. I also want to be a picker.
     
    beachedwhale likes this.

  15. AxelWolf

    AxelWolf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2016
    Likes:
    463
    Occupation:
    Guess
    Location:
    Las Vegaas
    Show me some examples of a google search “casino slot machine advantage play” and you could pull up dozens of plays. I could only guess these plays made available all over the place to include popular gambling magazines like Casino Player are either now dead or still exist and are promoted by casinos to draw more suckers to the casinos.

    BH:"Remember, these machines are not paying out anymore then they are programmed to" Correct(unless they make a mistake)however you don't really understand how AP works. And that's ok, but you seem to be one of the most bigotted person regarding AP. I just don't know how you can judge something, a group or someone that you have very little knowledge about.

    Your comments about the Revel prove my point about you commenting on stuff you don't know about.

    That promotion didn't end, it worked just as advertised. The only thin that happened is Bob Dancer contacted someone and then they took out the $25 VP. And they targeted someone who was with me on the $100 slot.

    I found something there that whoever tipped off the casino and other AP's missed. We waited a day to play it. It went off like a charm. too well in fact that they shut it down, no one lost money from my group.

    There was some other stuff going on that got people heat, however, they were hustlers acting like idiots attracting attention. I warned them, but they were foolish and they paid the price.

    There were plenty of people that played the promotion on various other things like $5 triple double, they played for many days those who lost and got back their money plus lots of extra free play, comp's and other stuff.
     
    beachedwhale likes this.
  16. AxelWolf

    AxelWolf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2016
    Likes:
    463
    Occupation:
    Guess
    Location:
    Las Vegaas
    FYI I'm not doubting you I'm just curious what a person without any AP knowledge would come up with and what it would mean.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2016
    beachedwhale likes this.
  17. LarryS

    LarryS Compulsive Liar Compulsive Liar

    Joined:
    May 8, 2015
    Likes:
    1,830
    exactly
     
    beachedwhale likes this.
  18. nate

    nate Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2016
    Likes:
    361
    Location:
    united states
    Who are you addressing? Are you drunk tonight? Because you're not your usual considerate, highly intelligent and insightful self tonight.

    Oh wait, my bad, I got you confused with FACE.
     
    beachedwhale likes this.
  19. nate

    nate Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2016
    Likes:
    361
    Location:
    united states
    Anytime is a good time these days. The technology is incredible and easier than it's ever been. And as any electronics, what you buy today is 150% more advanced and costs 50% less than I paid for old tech.
     
    beachedwhale likes this.
  20. nate

    nate Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2016
    Likes:
    361
    Location:
    united states
    But then again, you could be just jerking my chain.
     
    beachedwhale likes this.

Share This Page