Misc WizardOfVegas Forum is Dying

1. Not counting Biased wheel players, clockers or device users. System players only. How many of you play single zero and how many play double zero?
   
   
2. AxelWolf, Wednesday at 11:55 PM Report
3. #352 + Quote Reply
4. 
   
5. 
   RonaMember
   Joined:
   Jul 8, 2015
   Likes:
   10
   gizmo is the best and the only true roulette expert I ever met, the guy has obviously played more roulette spins that all the rest members combined.
   
   Rona, Thursday at 9:49 AM Report

1. 
   CASE CLOSED

 

She's a man obviously. And probably from wov.

 

While I like reading MC's stuff and I am not really offended by what he says.
There was no real way around that. How many posts did the mods have to take down/edit and monitor. He defiantly crossed the line many, many times. He and everyone knows it. So lets say they did extend him that courtesy, everyone would claim bias and special treatment.

You may not have been offended or care what he said(I didn't care myself). But what if you were his target? I don't think you would feel that way.

Personally I would have a private locked room and let people go at it(not viewable to others). One where they would only allow members who have been on for x amount of time to ask and agree to participate with a special password. I would have a few rules, No personal information, no attacking people who are not participating, no spreading lies(I could not say, "I seen KJ beating homeless people at the shelter" without proof).
No jumping in and out. If you can't handle the heat you could leave, but are restricted from participating again for x amount of months.

 

I have often wondered just what your deal is AxelWolf. I am not saying this too disparage you or start trouble, but it has always seemed to me that you are too concerned with all this crap about sock-puppets and exposing and even discrediting different people/players (on both sites). Perhaps you have some sort of detective gene in you and this fills that need. lol.

I generally don't take this approach. I don't care who is who, and who is posting under different names. Nor do I care all that much about someone talking non-sense and talking out their ass. I generally figure these folks will eventually expose and hang themselves. I also have this mentality that generally most members are smart enough to figure out who knows what they are talking about and who is just talking.

The one time, I went against my own sort of "live and let live" or "live and let them hang themselves" mentality, calling out a guy on another site, that was misleading members and especially newer players so egregiously that I just could not old my tongue, had pretty negative consequence for me. Leading to my banning from not only that site, but basically throughout the community.

So I am just wondering....is the "sell, hawk, con and scam" that I highlighted, basically the same concern I have for people being mislead, the motivation for why you much more routinely that I, challenge and generally have so much interest in who is who and who is saying what? Or is it just a desire to play 'detective'?

 

If you are talking about JJ. She was defiantly not a man. She was exactly who she said she was. I didn't believe she was real at the very beginning, but I quickly changed my tune on that.

I do think she was looking for a sugar daddy who liked to gamble. No I don't think she was a str8 up prostitute who would exchange sex for money.

 

And you as an admin should not have to judge whether someone presents themselves as a poorly raised vulgar newly out of the closet antisemite.......or a good Samaritan just trying to teach someone a "lesson".

He made that comment and then days afterwards came up with the "I was just trying to teach you a lesson.....I really didnt mean it...blah blah blah"

I dont think so. Instead his true self was displayed for a second. And its not the admins job to shield us from that display. Its not the admins job to shield us when people show their real selves.

As an admin, you know that was an insult. And yet you feel you need someone to complain about it and let you know?...really? You know about the death in the ovens comment. was it moved? I dont know..maybe it was I didnt look back.

It(KJS COMMENT) doesnt offend me to the point that i feel anger or angst/// but maybe it offends someone else.

Personally I want that up front where everyone can read it.......I love when people expose their real inner selves

And then trys to cover it up with his "teaching moment" excuse.

There are people on wov who treat people with disdain with hatred, with persecutory venom........and they are treated in kind here by others...including me. And if there are more mods at wov like FACE/FISK........they will be complimented here as is the case now as well.

So its not out of he blue unprovoked "nastiness"........but then again its not up to the admin to determine that either.

But for the people that support beached whale , husband of the year, and manboy.....they are supporting their actions and behavior.
While folks like me, freddy disagree

The way I figure it. If "your parents should have died in the ovens" is ok......then "beached whale just suspended someone today" is certainly ok

KJ just proved what a hypocrite he is.....so now he hides behind an excuse. days later telling us that he is a teacher of etiquette.

Without his newly minted excuse that he is offering me a teaching moment.......he couldnt critique anything on this thread without failing in credibility...without looking like a supreme hypocrite.

So now we get his "teacher" excuse.

So now we have a choice...is he a sick vulgar poorly raised viscous antisemite? or just one or 2 of the above.....take your pick. OR is he a helpful teacher trying to get trough to me like Sidney Portier in 'To Sir With Love"

we all can take our pick.

 

This is exactly the type of outside the box resolution that I would have liked to have seen taken place. I just don't feel like every effort was made. And Mickey is just way to valuable (and entertaining) to not exhaust every possibility to keep him.

And yes, there would have been some members that screamed "special treatment". Screw them. Mickey is special. Some might even argue Mickey is 'special education' special.

On the blackjack side of the AP community there is a guy, James Grosjean, who can be a real prick on the message boards. James has no love for me and I have been a target of his, a number of times. But James is brilliant, probably the top BJ and tables games AP playing today. So if I was running a blackjack and/or AP related site, I would damn sure find a way to allow James to participate, even if it meant bending the rules. The benefit just far outweighs the negatives. Mickey is in that same class to me (as are you). You just gotta find a way to include certain people! Or at least exhaust every option and I just don't feel that was done.

 

Is it just me or does anyone else just hear (read) whaaaat-whaaa, when Larry posts? It's just like listening to Charlie Brown's teacher.

 

Sorry, rona is the alias I referred to.

 

you're very contradictory today KJ, are you feeling well? "I'm a great guy and treat people so" and minutes later "'suck you larry and waa waa when larry posts" ??

 

sounds pretty confident

A declaration with no wiggle room....

 

I know people who have been scammed by this kind of stuff. Had they known that was a sock-puppet and their history it would have turned out different. I want to know who is who, especially since I oftentimes meet people in RL from the forums. Look at the shit that's happened with people like AOS and a few others.


I even explained a bit more before concerning that dam Nutrino on WOV and his blatant lies about Bovada. I wont go into full details.
I was tracking and playing a slot I was suspicious about. Him or his sock puppet claimed he hit it(one of the ones someone later proved COULDN'T HIT, you know the BV software scandal) so I scrapped what I was doing. Saying he hit that could have meant a few things. 1) It had a nice back up meter 2) it was not resetting. 3)He was lying(I later found out that to be the case even before the scandal). Had I known it was his sock-puppet I would have known he was blatantly lying and kept tracking.

Even if its innocent sock-puppeting it's a pet-peeve of mine. I don't know why people have to make up a bunch of stuff. Its one thing rounding up(I round up from 9.5 to 10"), inflating or sensualizing something, "The fish was this big." But why just totally making up shit?

 

If someone is so special to this site, then just ban them from this board, or any board he gets off on. Then you would only see him on the 'teaching board'. The result would be the teacher gets read on the teaching boards and no one has to read bullshit on lounge type boards. Is that censorship? Maybe, maybe not. The only reason this board exists is because people are free to keep the attacks alive. If you can't post on the board, your name and the attacks against you will fade away quickly because people get bored and nothing new to argue with and with no antagonist responses to the attacks. It dies a quiet death.

 

Don't know what Rona is...don't care. To me it's just another poster. She'll be out of the limelight soon enough when they see the newest WOV member. Ready?

New thread: "Hi, I'm AIMEE." It starts with "Hi y'all. My name is Aimee and I'm now 21 years old". She then says: "I need to learn about gambling before I go to Vegas". She ends with: TTFN.

She's already gotten the long, drawn out, rambling WOV welcome from one of the greens...the one with all the names. Another member has already asked her for a selfie. This should be fun!

 

LarryS: "but a 14 year old girl or a dude using a styeriotype might come off like that.

This is why MrV has invited her to Wov."

What are you trying to say larry?

 

She asked for advice with little to no specifics as to what she might want. I greeted her kindly and gave her a bit of general advice. How terrible of me.

 

I think that you have reached the point where avoiding it is no longer feasibly possible. If I may be forward enough to offer another suggestion, you mention that you guys handle a wide array of Forums, perhaps if you had any Moderators at those that are not otherwise interested in gambling but have a good relationship with you, then they would be willing to help. You would have an impartial Moderator who has little interest in the subject matter and would, presumably, remain impartial.

Even then, I think that your Rule set is simple enough and unobtrusive enough that there is almost no room for misinterpretation. That is especially true if you keep with your policy of only banning people for Doxxing (ever) and a few other things. If the post has an insult, it goes to the Graveyard, threads that contain insults must be moved to the Graveyard, only logged in Members can see the Graveyard. You might have the occasional spat over whether or not a post should have been moved to the Graveyard, but that's minor and the site looks better. Besides that, the complaining Member could simply copy/paste the post, remove the offending insult, and put the post back where it was with a new post.

It may become increasingly difficult, but I submit that one and exactly one Moderator could handle the workload right now, especially with how little would actually be policed. An hour per day, at most. I don't know what your financial situation looks like as a company, but you could even make it a paid position. Find someone whose job it is to ONLY Moderate and to otherwise not engage anyone in conversation if you are concerned about impartiality. They will never build relationships here and will remain inherently neutral.

It's not that gamblers are a different species, you're in the unique position where a not insubstantial percentage of your posters, and perhaps the majority of your most active posters, are people who have already been banned from a heavily moderated gambling forum, and you have a thread that has those people who are largely pissed about that. Despite their denials that they don't care. They are not going to police themselves when they are all in agreement as to what they are doing and why.

But...you could make the Forum look a lot better by giving this sort of thing its own special place, viewable only to Members. You don't have to censor your material, just control its presentation.

If you ban, you effectively censor. Other than doxxing, threats and other extremes, I don't think you should censor. If you begin to censor, then you will stop being unique from other gambling forums. I think you should control how the site is presented, and that would entail having threads like this not viewable unless you are a member.

It's cost/benefit, sure, but finding one person to read all of the posts...especially if the Forum can be managed without banning and/or censorship...is not a huge cost.

 

no it could mean many other things

It could mean that someone not in on the conversation found it offensive but feels no standing to comment or request action
It could mean that someone like me finds it offensive but moves on quickly and doesnt want action as with the sick antisemite's comment
It could mean that a lurker non member read it and found it offensive and ran away

you are naive to think just because something is not reported...that no one finds it offensive

Now with me...if I find something offensive I note it and dont get upset. I dont allow myself to experience anger or angst. Others get a stroke....get hysterical. But all the above may never hit the report link.

So for me the rules are great...I can dish it out...i can take it...its all good...I dont need mommy looking out after me or someone like mission telling me that I am "the weakest link".

believe it or not when anonymous people post something that may be offensive.....it doesnt effect me one way or the other.

but others may allow themselves to explode, cry, feel anger, sadness, emotional pain......all from an anonymous person

All of that is of no concern for an admin under these board rules. having to tell someone"you shouldnt feel offended by that" or "that is only a small insult"...should not be the admins job.

Sarcasm can be insulting.....calling someone a "real genious" was cause for suspension at wov
A take off of their screen name might be insulting

and then there is the more direct insults....like Howmany.....telling us ....she is so fat no one will fuck her,(which I can do without but I dont see how u can differentiate)

good luck.....sorting thru all the variations

 

I have no clue what you are talking about with the me and KJ thing please elaborate.
If he has logged on from my IP PLEASE LET ME KNOW so I can check my closet. It should be easy to coach him out of a closet a 2nd time.(sorry KJ I could not resist <3)

Lets not forget you guys invited me as one of your founding member gaming experts.
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I am not even good with all this VPN hiding IP and proxy crap. But just with a little willingness to do it, I think its easier than, I think, you think.

Many online casinos have very good VPN/PROXI detection systems, security measures and staff in place with a million serious reasons to detect them, yet I can easily fool them.

Would you like me to show you how one can be a sock-puppet from two different countries without being detected? If I can what shall be my reward?

If you look deeper into some people and then see their motives you might see the connections better. I'm rarely wrong on sock-puppets. And if I am wrong, I usually find out quickly and apologize.

I guarantee you there is something off with the person we are talking about(ya, ya, I know she sucked up and complimented you after you accused Advantageplayer of doing worst).
We are talking about someone who claims to be a highly educated gambling expert, one who consistently beat high limit roulette in AC and LV(just look online). Then go read all "her" posts you can find. Then tell me something isn't seriously off. As LarryS said "she" talks like a 14 year old or something like that, including many other tells. I would be willing to put my money where my mouth is. You should have no problem with that since you have a fancy detection methods.

Its amazing that you allow constant trolling,lies,blatant racial and gay hate content, pimping offers, fat shamming, threats, verbal attacks of members that include their personal lives. People have to jump though hoops to keep their addresses, pictures off the forum(AFTER THE FACT without any repercussions).

Yet, I just said "she" was PEGGED as Sock-puppet, a true statement(by multiple people BTW). And that is what crosses the line?

You may not allow any blatant selling or scamming, however you have no idea what's going on behind the scenes. You have created a comfortable nice place for scammer to "secretly" operate.