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Roulette Math Players vs System Players

Discussion in 'Roulette Forum' started by Keyser Soze, Dec 11, 2021.

  1. soxfan

    soxfan Well-Known Member

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    Serious cat what got a winnings style just play so many shoe per day/sessions. So if yer style is good for 2 units nets profits per shoe then make no sense logical to set a win goal of 50 unit. Honest, only bulls-shitter and chickens-shits scared, loser recreational player engage in the arbitrary stops/win-loss foolishness as if it gonna turn their losings style into the winners, hey hey.
     
    Median Joe likes this.
  2. SPIKE

    SPIKE Well-Known Member

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    As usual you have no idea what you're talking about. Why don't you try shutting the fuck up and let the people who know what they're doing talk.
     
  3. Median Joe

    Median Joe Active Member

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    There's no harm in having a win goal, but it doesn't give you any advantage. There may be some psychological merit but mathematically it's worthless. Any win goal you set is completely arbitrary. Having a win goal without an edge is just like using a progression; you may reach your target 99 times out of 100 but on the 1 time in 100 you don't you will give it all back and more. Stop losses don't work either and are also completely arbitrary. Setting a low win goal is nonsensical if you think it's going to make any difference to your bottom line, because all that matters is how many bets you make, not when you quit a session. How is 10 sessions with a target of 1u different from 1 session with a win goal of 10u? No difference at all. So if your wife decided to stop playing after winning X dollars on the slots it doesn't mean she'll be any better off in the long run.

    And if you do have an edge win goals are unnecessary. Again, it doesn't make sense to play on and on if you're feeling tired or whatever, but otherwise play as long as you like and you'll continue to win. If you don't it means you have no edge.

    I'm not saying discipline isn't important, but that has nothing to do with setting win goals and loss limits, which are complete bunkum.
     
  4. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    Sounds like a nice story but it disregards common sense. Stock traders bracket their trades based on low level common moving averages. Their stop losses and stop wins assure them of success. They play on the common movements of support / resistance changes and past results. I will provide you with a video that contradicts your position / reasoning.

     
  5. Nathan Detroit

    Nathan Detroit Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    With Median Joe the rise of the D.G.
     
  6. Median Joe

    Median Joe Active Member

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    No gizmo, what you're talking about is triggers. If you've discovered that certain triggers give an advantage, then that's your system. A trader might have triggers based on support & resistance which must be adhered to. That trader could play all day and night providing he sticks to the triggers. It would be the same with Blackjack, where the trigger is a high count. If card-counting why would you stop after making 1 unit, like Spike does? What he is saying is that keeping win goals low is good strategy but doesn't give any reasons why. If it's supposed to prevent the house edge "catching up", well that's nonsense, especially as he is always saying you never play in the long run. But even if he admits that the house edge can affect you in a session it still makes no sense to keep win goals low. The only thing which affects you is the number of bets made over time, and it doesn't matter if you split those bets into 100 short sessions or 10 long ones.
     
  7. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    No median joe.

    Here is a graph of 200 spins all bet on red at $90. It shows common enough swings for anyone with skills to "target" changes that occurred without regard to bet selections. It makes you into a blind person giving advise about what can be seen. In your case you can't see anything. That's good too.

    graph.png
     

  8. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    more -- no median joe. In the video he says that the chickens commonly keep the wins low and that the suckers stay too long on the losses. He targets the top of the moving averages. He places buys on upturns after the bottom hits in a moving average. The point is that you were shown a reason to have stop losses and stop wins. It had no effect on you. So discussing how your brain works is way too boring.
     
  9. Median Joe

    Median Joe Active Member

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    gizmo, you're missing the point. Ok, if you can target those swings and make the right entry & exits what's to stop you playing? why would you stop at 1 unit? The only reason Spike gives is "everyone has goals". That's a terrible argument. WHY should you have small win goals, especially if your win rate is 80% on the ECs? :rolleyes:
     
    thereddiamanthe likes this.
  10. Naughty but nice

    Naughty but nice Well-Known Member

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    Do colours remain equal in a stream or does one show stronger, but only to fall back and look equal or weaker.
    upload_2022-7-31_14-20-10.png
    I nearly tanked on these.
    But after about 90 spins it was better to bet black. Made the 10% on 3000.
    Observation
     
  11. Median Joe

    Median Joe Active Member

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    The stop losses and wins are part of the system. Just like Spike says often he doesn't bet when the outcomes aren't "playing his game". But why log out of the casino when he's made just one unit? He could play for hours and provided he only bets when conditions are favorable he will win at the same rate. Why should his win rate suddenly revert to 18/37 when he's made 1 unit? LOL!
     
  12. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    Why should I do what Spike does? I set up the RR thread years ago at 3 net wins stop point or 7 net losses stop point. Many have tried it and outperformed the magical math beliefs.

    It's based on not chasing after the super win streaks but grinding away at the little changes. I get why Spike stops. He knows that the upticks are enough to aggregate a single net win. Anyway, you are a mathNazi without any common sense. You don't rate discussing this.
     
  13. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    Why be a mathZombie? It's your system. LOL
     
  14. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    Of course there are times when there is a strong side and a weak side. If that were your only capacity to see conditions then it would be enough to take advantage of any casino. If you place 100 bets on the stronger side, even after changes, then you might easily get 60 of them right. If you are flat betting then the math expectation does not conform to the outcomes expected by just placing bets on one side and hoping for the best. I look at your list of spin results and I can easily see strong side and weak side conditions.
     

  15. Naughty but nice

    Naughty but nice Well-Known Member

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    upload_2022-7-31_14-36-1.png
    Here continuous betting.
    upload_2022-7-31_14-36-54.png
    Black is stronger
    +300
    upload_2022-7-31_14-38-7.png
     
  16. gizmotron

    gizmotron Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    The mathTards would have you believe that it's always even and that there is no strong side weak side. They only see things like a million spins as if that is some kind of magical rose colored glasses. Then, the funny part, they make comments.
     
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  17. Nathan Detroit

    Nathan Detroit Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    Those cats need lessons in accounting to get real.
     
  18. SPIKE

    SPIKE Well-Known Member

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    Not just a win goal, any kind of goal. My wife says I should be she takes $200 to the casino and when she loses that she leaves. A win implies you have an edge and if you do not a win goal is ridiculous. My wife should also have a rule that if she doubles her money she leaves.
     
  19. Nathan Detroit

    Nathan Detroit Well-Known Member Founding Member

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    A certain baccarat player is using a 4 step power marti 1 3 7 15 .
     
  20. Keyser Soze

    Keyser Soze Active Member

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    I can’t remember if I ever posted anything about win targets and stop losses.

    In my case, I don’t necessarily set a win target (dollar amount) but mostly care about setting a win goal. ND said it best:
    Spin 1 = W (play 2nd spin)
    Spin 2 = L (play 3rd spin)
    Spin 3 = W (walk away) and so on. But I’m not gonna lie, I’ve broken that rule numerous times. Sometimes it worked out in my favour and sometimes it doesn’t.

    Now when it comes to stop losses. The only time I’ll set a stop loss is when I’m already in profit. Usually 30% - 40% then walk away. I really don’t see a point setting a stop loss if I have a $500 starting bankroll and already losing 30% off the bat.
    What I mean by this, is if my bankroll lost 30% I should walk by then.

    I’m comfortable losing the $500. If I wasn’t I would’ve just have my starting bankroll of $150 to begin with.

    Like everybody says “Always bring a bankroll you’re comfortable losing”.
    So if you don’t mind losing $100 then only bring with you $100. Don’t be bringing $1000 bankroll but you’re only comfortable losing $100.
    Makes no sense.
     

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