Misc WizardOfVegas Forum is Dying

Calling someone an "AP," whatever that is supposed to be, is descriptively useless, considering the range of behaviors that ostensibly fall under this umbrella.

I get a kick out of people who think they can handicap horses, college football, baseball, NFL, and so on as if some general set of skills or data base solves them all. People who do that are like MDs claiming they're gastros, neuros, and pediatricians all rolled into one.

Mickey, do you find someone claiming to be a "professional gambler" to be an oxymoron because no professional gambler would label himself as such (kind of like carrying a card saying "professional hitman"), or is there another reason(s)?

 

I think the APS are another reason that wov is dying

 

And Larry is the reason legitimate gamblers don't come here to post on any topics related to gambling.

 

C'mon, man. You have to see it...

Accomplishment yearns to be broadcast. Axel does something few can do and he talks about it. He has a skill, he did things, a person takes pride in that and desires recognition for it. It's entirely common, it's entirely human. Crimm bangs on about his machine skills every day. He's a high toned motherfucker taking the slots world by storm. He's doing something few can. Many tried, most fail, he didn't. It desires recognition. I write plenty about my racing or athletics or fishing because I did something, I made something, I accomplished something. It feels good to say, it feels good to have it recognized.

What of you, LarryS? I know I've read how you've made an irrefutable point on Patrick's site that got through to some people, people who asked questions as a result, people who were summarily banned for it. I remember your victory lap, how you got people to see through the ruse, helped those innocent folks, and put another dagger into a fraud. That's what most of this thread is, is it not? How many times have you pointed out "change" in WoV, and wondered aloud if it wasn't Mr. S who had spoke truth and caused it? And how good it was to "help your neighbor", and prevent poor treatment?

It's one thing to be a narcissistic braggart, but an occasional boast or vie for recognition? Everyone does it. Even you. And it's A-OK.

 

The only top 5 AP were missing from WOV is IBYA aka IDMP...Wait a minute...

 

Vying for recognition? Insecure? Needy? What's the difference...especially on an anonymous board? Can't pull it off with family and friends so...hit the forums.

We've got them all here. Narcissistic braggarts? Check. Pathological liars? Check. For some it absolutely is "look at me".

 

I am very different. My accomplishments in life, the big ones(besides helping to raise a family)......have given me great financial freedom, while I helped people....even saved a few lives in the process. Helped them with their health, with navigating through redtape in order for them to get their healthcare while paying less money or no money. And have done pro bono work along the same lines. Here also and with patrick I feel I helped others. Does it make me feel good to help others? Fuck yeah....its all I know since I graduated college.
Before that I was a self serving, uncaring, narcissist teen/yoing adult.

So when an AP tells me how everyone else hates their job and how blessed he is to have his "job"....i have no problem pointing out the difference between me and him.

This board is filled with people saying how useless this thread is....so yes I will point out in response the positives, the results. And my personal life accomplishments only surface when responding to people like that AP who has the superiority complex over the working stiffs like me.

If he wants to tell us how joyous his life is...fine. Just dont try to drag people like me down in comparison. As he does that he unleashes response from others that might annoy him and others like him...Well thats just too bad.

He unleashes conversation on value to society. He unleashes conversation about "happiness".....which is fine. I am willing to talk about that.

Still, personally, assuming a usual cross section of the population of "professionals":......I would rather raise a family in a neighborhood filled with school teacher or physicians, or pharmacists, or lawyers, or nurses in good standing.....rather than a neighborhood filled with professional gamblers or full time gamblers. I have given my reason before...not to beat a dead horse.....but a crack addict child molester is not ever discharged from the community of full time gamblers........while a governing board will strip the other folks with those occupations of their membership.

So being a fraternal member of full time gamblers in good standing, which includes child molester crack addicts...an AP has no real ammunition throwing stones with an air of superiority over us working stiffs....even if he throws us working stiffs a bone sometimes and buys us a 500 dollar steak dinner with his comps

 

Great straw man stuff, Larry. You are an expert at construing someones words to something they didn't say then refuting the argument they never made.

You would make a good speechwriter for your favorite hack politician.

 

Jesus! It must be hard to look in the mirror and not think Spider-man is looking back at you. With great power comes great responsibility....

Or, conversely, Spider-man! It must be hard to look in the mirror and not think Jesus is looking back at you.

 

comic book mind gives comic book response

 

I have mentioned this before. The term Advantage Play(er) is relatively new and wasn't a common term until sometime in the the 2000's, I don't know the first time I heard it. Casino called what we now call AP's either team players or pro's. I have heard the term corporate players as well a few times (yes some teams incorporate)

The term Advantage player describes anyone full time, part time, rarely or at the time. Someone could normally just be a ploppy and suddenly understand he has a advantageous situation and while hes playing it he's an advantage player at that moment only.

Professional gambler separates a gambler who just likes gambling and taking risks on -EV stuff from someone who makes a living from gambling.

Professional

1. 1.
   of, relating to, or connected with a profession.
   
   
2. 2.
   (of a person) engaged in a specified activity as one's main paid occupation rather than as a pastime
3. 3 :someone who has a lot of experience or skill in a particular job or activity

The term Professional Gambler(s) goes back a very long time so I'm not sure what the argument is, as it fits in with many meanings of the word. Most people accept it as a profession and know it to be possible. People list it on loan applications, insurance, taxes etc etc.

Anyone can call themselves a professional anything but that doesn't make it true only your wallet, bank account, family, partners, accountant, know the truth. 95% of the time with a very short conversation I can tell if someone is an advantage player or just a gambler who's full of shit.

 

WTF Is with all the likes here? They are complete BS I had 3 likes before anyone possibly had a chance to read and like my post it was almost imitate.

 

You're an IDIOT if you like this post.

 

And that's exactly what I thought members, views and activity and now likes on this forum(particularly the views and likes on this thread) are fake as hell.

 

Ok I see my mistake that's your total likes not that particular post, so I take back the fake likes part but not the fake views and members.

 

Short answer: Networking is a major benefit of being an AP.

RS gave a pretty good answer (#3009), but I will weigh in as well. I don't feel like like most AP's that I know that participate on any site “gloat”. A few do. They are usually the phony's and they get called out by other members of the community as such. Most just are sharing their experiences with other like minded people, some going through some of the same experiences.

Many AP's don't share anything, choosing never to participate on any kind of message board. Other's participate, hoping only to acquire some tidbit of information, maybe a promo or something that can benefit them. Others choose to share some of their experiences. What's wrong with that LarryS? Isn't that what a forum specific to gambling (gamblingforums), Las Vegas (WoV), or blackjack (such as some of the others that I used to participate at) is about? Why do you think that is not an appropriate topic for such a forum?

Now I will get specific, involving my own situation. The first blackjack AP forum I joined was 2006. I was in my third year of supporting myself solely from blackjack play. In 2006, in my early 20's, I made $11,000 as a professional blackjack player, and my first 2 years were slightly less. Does that sound like a person who participated to “gloat”? I joined and participated to learn from others who were sharing their experiences.

It is no coincidence that the year after I joined that first site, my earnings nearly tripled to $26,000, and the next year $38,000. Followed by a string of $50K+ years to where I now in year 13 average just about 6 figures. That's not gloating....that is fact. I joined several blackjack AP sites as part of my education process and I have not been disappointed. I have picked up things from many different members on all three blackjack AP sites that I have been a member of. Sometimes little minor things, sometimes things that have been a major benefit.

WoV was the first forum that I joined and participated at that was not specifically a blackjack AP related site. Honestly, when I joined WoV, It was with the intent of maybe picking up some info, about different promos and things that might benefit me. But there were a handful of blackjack AP's there and a few AP's in other areas like Axel and Mickey (RS who I knew and liked from other sites, joined shortly after) so there was some AP talk, blackjack and other that I enjoyed. There was also some discussions on the topic of Vegas, my home town, that I enjoy talking about. And low and behold I found I even enjoyed discussing some other topic like sports and even politics.

So again, I ask you what is wrong with that? Why do you make this judgment that real AP's wouldn't participate on message boards? Your posts always indicate a dislike for AP's. A disapproval of anyone who opts to make a living in this manner. A completely legal and in my opinion ethical manner. If the casino industry itself is ethical than it is equally so for a player to win at those games fairly and within the rules. So I don't get your judgment, but to each his own. But what is very apparent to me from your comments, is that you don't know many real AP's, because your vision of AP's is not what has been my experience in dealing with numerous AP's. Sure, just like anything else in life, some are dicks, but most are just people working and making a living.

The one generalization, I will make about AP's is that many AP's seem to have the loner type trait. That's not to say there is no one else in our lives, but I find that trait prevalent. It also is an occupation that you don't discuss much with friends and family as they just don't know or understand. That may be why some choose, even enjoy sharing their experiences (which you seem to object to), with other AP's, who know what they are talking about and going through.

In my own case, I have a partner, in life and business (AP). He does understand all aspects of what I do, and likely what I go through. But you know what, when I hit a rough patch, months of losing piling up, or a whole year far below expectation, as I did just a couple years ago, I don't want to share all that frustration with him. I don't want to bring him down or have him worry. So, I share my frustration with other AP's that surely have experienced the same feelings from time to time.

So, again, I don't understand your disdain for AP's, but that's your right. I just though maybe sharing some of my thoughts and experiences on the matter may allow you to understand AP's a little better, because you surely have demonstrated that you don't understand AP's (in addition to not liking them).

 

I hate the 'likes' type thing. And I do pretty well with a surprisingly large number of likes, despite that many don't "like" me.

Qfit's blackjack site has a similar 'helpful' feature. And I did pretty good there, one of the higher 'helpful' ratings. And when push came to shove, still was exiled for personal reasons. And personal reasons and feeling is the bottom line for this type of feature. These sites always turn in to certain different "cliques", a lot like high school. So any kind of 'like' or helpful' ratings is going to turn mostly into a popularity contest.

So, don't take offense at your lack of 'like' total. Just being from WoV, makes you a villain here to many. If it makes you feel any better, I think your presence here raised the bar here, so a public thank you. (I guess I could have 'liked' many of your posts, but given my feelings that I just expressed on the 'like' subject, I just don't participate much on that feature).

 

Mickey as usual your analysis was spot on... Larry actually makes RobSinger bearable

 

That's certainly better than a "FUCK YOU AXEL".

I appreciate the kind words.

Now that I have you here.... a few things.
1) Do you have an Email. I actually had a very valuable a very low risk high earn BJ/craps play I was considering bringing you and your partner in on.(no counting needed) I'm certain you would've been interested in it.

I was about to have RS or someone contact you for me. Had I had a contact method I would've done it days ago.

Also what's up with your book thing? It will probably be one of two gaming books I will ever be interested in getting.

 

I sent both you and RS an email last weekend. Neither replied. For you I used the email address you posted here a couple weeks ago, a gmail account. Maybe that is an account you don't use. But yes, [email protected]

My book is still quite a ways a way. Mainly because I haven't allocated any time to work on it. Frankly, I am having second thoughts on the whole idea, which is a problem because I am under contract. Maybe over the winter with the brutal cold weather days here in Vegas, I will "find" some motivation and really get going.

And another thing....fuck you Axel....don't be so sensitive.