Misc WizardOfVegas Forum is Dying

Also want to take this opportunity to admit that I was wrong on this one. I am a big enough person to admit that, when it occurs.

Although the circumstances involving "newish" WoV poster Billryan, seemed very similar to Qfit, Billryan is not Qfit. He appears to have been a member of Ken Smith's old site where Qfit and I were both members. But when Smith's site shut down, Billryan (who had a different yet unknown handle at Smith's site) chose not to migrate with some of us to Qfit's site (smart move Billryan).

So anyway, while Billryan recently came out of the woodwork to level criticism at me, he is more than entitled to do so. The only thing I ask (if he is reading) is that he reveal what his handle on Smith's site was, so I know who is he and can address his accusations and concerns.

 

This is nothing but your assumption only being based on what you're reading. Yet, when I make an assumption based on what I read, I'm charged with making shit up and smearing Mike.

I assume he turned to sports betting in a big way a long time ago. I also assume the reason he's keeping a hidden low profile about his own gambling activity is because his new boss wants it that way. The last thing they want customers to know was that the owner was forced to sell his sites because he has a gambling problem. Not a good promotion for any type of gambling, online or land if the guy promoting it lost everything with his own theory's.

The new owners need to capitalize on what reputation he did create and what's left of it. Once they have squeezed all they could from it, he'll be dropped like a hot coal. I'm sure there are plenty of math guys out there that could do the same math for profit.

Whatever personal gambling he's doing they don't want it shared on the forums, unless it's for diagnostic purposes for the benefit of the forum readers. Notice there are no more Jackpot pictures coming from him since he became an employee.

I understand everyone's concern about how he runs a public forum and with good reason. Yet, I believe you're all missing the real issues that lay beneath that ultimately have an impact on the obvious surface.

Once again, this is all my assumptions which I believe will eventually sooner or later surface with fact.

When you're trying to promote online gaming sponsors and profit sharing, having AP's telling everyone how they beat the pants off casinos is a good promotion and good for gaining new customers. That's why they are welcomed and usually treated like royalty. When someone comes along and challenges their alleged claims with reasonable argument they will disappear like a magicians prop.

I also suspect that Kewlj might possibly be a threat of getting in the way of some type of for profit business. I understand he is liked and interesting, but in reality he's just not that much of a big deal. There has to be more to it for such a big deal being made of just a good member.

 

great post mightymike........I wish I could like it 2 times
that quote speak volumes about the situation.....................

 

I love how they talk about trasnparency on WoV

where was the transparency when Exoter, Kentry, JohnCena, 1BB, and all the rest got nuked??????????????????

 

Ha. The only transparency was from the usual asswipes calling for the banning of those guys. And a lot of those asswipes are relatively new members. Plants? No doubt some are. You don't just show up and act like that...asking for thr "ban hammer" feeding the ego of the mentally ill beached whale. She says she's so smart so why does an old lady hang out on a forum with all guys? Maybe she likes the young ones.

 

No I won't publicly name the member nor the mod, but it was posted on Jan 14:

Jan 14, 2016
So you made money getting BJ's instead of giving BJ's? That is a great feeling.

 

i have been enjoying Vegas, so I did not have much time to post but here is my thoughts on my post on suspension at WOV.

Having been suspended multiple times, it has never bothered me and everytime I was, I knew it was possibly coming based on the post. I have always been one to say what I think, understanding there may be consequences but it is who I am. I don't regret what I say and those who know me, know I am the same person if you meet me. It may cause problems, lose friends and more, but like Popeye, I yam who I yam.

Most of my comments that have causes problems occurred when debating issues that I am passionate about such as politics. I honestly find it hard to believe someone can have the beliefs Bluejay does and when debating it, he wanted to question my education and intelligence. So I fought back in the way I know how. I lived.

Over the years I debated with Ahigh, 1BB and B9. To me all came off as asses in different ways. Ahigh seemed like a know it all and refused to listen to anyone. In the case of the other 2 we get to where we are today. I was and still am a huge believer in the rights of a business owner to do whatever the hell they want if it is legal. The only person that loses if they make the wrong decisions is them and any investors they have. Which is why I have always supported the Wizards right to ban people, tell them to leave or whatever. I still do although it has changed in that we have no clue what his position is in regards to doing that. And it's not my business to know his deal with Chan. Obviously from an operation of the forum nothing has changed. I assume Chan is doing fine and really doesn't feel a need to deal with it. Successful people like him look at the big picture, not the minor details on a few dollars.

At WOV I never felt I was a valuable member/ customer in that I never spent money on the online and took far more in info than I added. I would post some AC stuff, and info on things I did in Vegas and PA casinos. I met some good people and learned from some of the best. Those who question what some of the AP players actually make and know are wrong. They are at the top of their game, but it takes hard work, a good head and discipline. They are good people to learn from. Mickey and KJ fall in that group.

When Mike waved his tin cup, I donated $100 based on taking him at his word that he needed it and considered it cheap for what I had learned off the site. When the sale came out, I didn't like it, as it seemed things would change and good posters were concerned about privacy and thought they might leave. I also hated to see foreign owners involved but that comes back to my politics. When Mike made the offer to donate the money from anyone upset to a women's shelter, I took him up on but instead asked him to donate it to a local Vegas animal shelter. When others called him out on taking the money while trying to sell, I defended him. Sales fall through all the time and he may well have been in trouble financially. If he wasn't, it was a good cash grab.

So what changed? For me it was the KJ situation. Mickey made his bed and knew he would be gone but KJ was setup 100% and was treated like shit from the start of the Norm deal by Mike. There is no other explanation and the silence makes it obvious. We all know the rules and either agree to them or don't and leave. Either by choice or my force, banning. From the start I was one who said we lost a good poster who shared so much professionally and personally for someone who added nothing other than it seems being a friend of Mikes. I questioned it and others did as well. But the final straw was the comments on the situation and the closing of thread by Mike the other night. So I opened a new thread , knowing it would not be received well, but saying what I thought needed saying. I was shocked I wasn't banned, but given a suspension, again, mikes forum, his decision. However the comment to feel free to not come back got me. What the hell was that? If you don't want me there, ban me. I'll live.

I will not be going back as a poster, that I am sure of. He made it clear how he feels and obviously the KJ situation is getting to him. I know some of you will find this strange but I have no hard feelings toward Mike. It's almost sad how he is acting but again I go back to my basic belief that a business owner can do what they want. They are the one who loses if they run the business into the ground. And even if he doesn't own it, the owners are allowing it to be used as his playground.

So this is where I differ from Larry, Freddy and some others. Every decision he makes is his options and if it fails, it's the right of a business owner to fuck it up. Or some owner to allow staff to do it. Not my money and someone always moves in to fill any void left.

So it looks like this is my new home for gambling related posting. I'm sure I'll get into a few debates and hopefully KJ will make this his home on gambling issues as he used to at WOV. Maybe others will come and add good info, or not.

 

As a new sign up, but fairly long time reader, who for some ungodly reason decided to read the whole threads on both boards dating back years...I'd like to go on record that NO, you don not come off happy at all. You clearly define bitterness, spitefulness and hate in almost every single post of yours as far back as starting here. And you or all of your aliases, more than anyone else I've read on this or the other site, have something to say about everybody else in almost every single post almost without exception. I couldn't care less what your reaction is.
Have a great day.

 

On contractual paper that is correct. But in the reality of running the board I see no difference than before the day the contract was signed.
And the saying "mikes place, mikes rules" still prevails among members who would dismiss heavy handed actions as the right of the manboy.
All of a sudden that "right" is being questioned.

 

Funny thing is I am happy to read your post. It makes me giddy when I have someone by the balls and I can decide when to let go.
Your major point that I have "aliases" was addressed by the admin. when someone else accused me of that. And guess what......he(the accuser) was wrong. And that was around 2-3 weeks ago. So what do you think little guy? Do you think in the last 3 weeks I all of a sudden started to use aliases?? Do you think keeping my same screen name from wov was stupid for someone who clearly according to you wanted to deceive?
This is why this board is so much fun.....because of people like you. Carry on.

 

I never said he didnt have the RIGHT to fuck up.(and never did the others but i will speak for myself). Like you said, one of the consequences of fucking up is loss of business. And one of the paths to losing business is customer complaints in the community. In the old days it was word of mouth, neighbor to neighbor over the picket fence. But now with the internet customer service fuck-ups are "outed" on places like this.

If this thread died a quick death a year ago.....maybe the domino effect you see now occurring over there doesnt take place. Who knows.

This thread has shined the light on customer mistreatment for a long time, and the reason it has lasted so long is that there is always something new. Always a new customer mistreated.

Maybe if people were brave earlier, this would not have happened to KJ. The manboy would have been put on notice that there would be consequences if he acted like he did. But to him a slow quiet exodus of people as has been happening over time... is not a big consequence to him.

As far as you getting more out of the site than you gave.....therefore you shouldnt be treated as a valued customer shows the typical mentality that allowed the climate that caused the KJ situation.
You can go to a psychiatrist and pay them 150 dollars and feel that you get more worth from them than a lousy 150 dollars...therefore you shouldnt be treated as a valued patient??? You can go to a restaurant and pay 100 dollars for a meal and feel that the food is so good that you dont need to be treated as a valued customer. And you can make contributions to wov and feel that you dont need to be treated as a valued customer. Thats fine...I cannot insist that people have self respect. I cant insist that people see their value in contributing to a business either monetarily or in time and effort.
But the reality is.....even if someone goes to that site and asks questions only...they are contributing time and effort to that site. If their question draws attention of other people who want to read the answer.....and the site becomes known for having good Q and A threads.....then the people asking the questions do have value.
Without posters they would close that section down, and visit volume would decrease...and revenue would decrease as well.

 

Yeah, I remember that, as well as who posted. I can't say that I was offended all that much. I've had much worse things said about me. But it was inappropriate. This person has a history of snide homophobic remarks.

 

A fine post Boz. I appreciate your support, but am still sorry it lead to your suspension, even though you did so willingly.

One thing. Several times you make the point that it is Mike's site, or was, and now while it isn't, he is still in charge, so has the right to run it as he sees fit. This is true, but this is a little different than other businesses in that the membership does have some skin in the game in that they have invested their time and effort in contributing to the site which added to it's value. It's almost like they have a little investment in the site.

I'm not suggesting they are entitled to anything financially, but they are entitled to have their voices heard and opinions considered. While someone needs to actually make the call on different decisions and that would be Mike, I would think he would ask for input from members in some areas to make them feel inclusive. They also are due a little more respect from the guy that benefited so handsomely, than to hear things like "don't let the door hit you in the ass". That is simply the words of a selfish control freak who uses people, benefits, and then tosses them aside with no appreciation for what they have contributed to his success.

 

lol. No. Since last year. It's unfortunate that you're so consumed by hate as you seem fairly intelligent. You so solidly proved my point and you haven't the clarity to see it. None of your attacks bothers me in the least as you don't have me by anything. Did I mention you're an obsessed closed minded bitter, self centered and lacking self respect enough to let it go. You are teetering on manic depression and need professional help. Seriously. Such bi-polar writing with no awareness of it is something to take serious. Get help for your hatred.
Good luck.

 

I think we agree for the most part, I just see it as if you don't like how he is running the business, don't support it and it will fail if enough others feel the same way. I know we get attached to a business, like a favorite restaurant, store or even a forum. It's sad to see them screw it up and you want to say "Wake up, your blowing it", but many times they don't see it or care. I see it all the time in the restaurant business.

It's easy to see when you see less customers and the food quality is going down. You keep going back a few times, hoping it was just one time and it will get back to normal, but it doesn't. And you see less people there each time. It's sucks because you want it to be the same. But it's not and it seems those in charge just don't care.

Maybe that is what these guys have been saying for a while, they say the number of visitors are down. Maybe Mike doesn't have a financial stake in the game and is just being who he really is. That is the most dangerous manager of all, one with little concern if the business succeeds or fails and owners who don't care either.

I do hope a few more who are not happy start voting with their wallet as well. Because it's obvious it's not the same over there.

And as I said earlier, I do hope you start posting the kind of stuff you did over there. Maybe something can be built here other than the reputation of a place to bash WOV, deserved or not.

 

Honestly, it's not about the fortune or fame/poverty or infamy per se, even to whom that occurs; it's about what and who makes sense to you, and how comfortable you are as you make your own way through life. Nobody else can tell you if you're comfortable or not. I mean, something like smoking actually does help schizophrenics relax.

Gambling forums, or anything else on the internet, isn't worth all the mania/depression it tends to cause in the end. It might be fun to continue pointing this out... I haven't come to that point of conclusion yet.

 

What's sad here is, the core group (at least LarryS & freddy) are under the opinion they're having some "sophisticated adult discussion", when in reality it's just a giant shit-flinging and name-calling thread. It's obvious this thread has nothing to do with making recommendations or discussing the goings-on at WoV, but is simply used to belittle Mike & WOV moderators as well as others. Why else for the name-calling and bringing up other stuff (like Mike's finances)?

Meh, whatever. I'll still keep reading (don't worry, guys, I'm still here!). I'll make a suggestion, if I may: Try not to make super long posts (few paragraphs max) with not super long paragraphs. Makes it a bit more difficult to read and I'll likely just pass right over if it's a long post.

Nate, +1.

 

you are just making accusations without going on a limb and offering what you deem to be proof.
So go ahead and list the aliases you claim that I take on
be a brave guy....you used the plural.....so more than one would be nice to see..
At least I speak of specific issues at wov. I refer to specific mistreatments and specific uneven application of rules.
The list is long and I have noted each one as they occured...as have others on this site even with quotes and links, with the citing of specific names.
You come on with generalized bullshit.
How about the specific aliases you claim I have
go ahead "lol boy"

 

If its "shit flinging"....its "shit flinging" that has garnered alot of interest and alot of views and alot of sign ups to this site.
Generally name calling only is not enough to garner such interest. There has to be some truth amid the "shit flinging" that you refer to.
Truth that keeps people coming back.
Truth that has this one thread approaching 28,000 views.
Truth that has this site on the map over at wov

Simple "shit flinging" can be easily dismissed. However this thread cannot be easily dismissed. And it hasnt been dismissed. It has been viewed consistently.
People dont continually view total crap. They may disagree with the way things are presented, but the truth seems to surface.

Of course I never would present my opinions in the fashion I do here if I was allowed to post on wov. No way. I understand that.
But thats the downside to banishing people....they can go elsewhere and the gloves come off. They can complain that they dont like the manner in which they are discussed when they created the situation. They dared people to leave and post elsewhere. And some people just slinked away, and others took them up on their proposal.They have no basis for complaint. Especially when truth is involved.

Its simply opinion based on the truth presented sometimes in a biting, sarcastic, punishing manner. Who the fuck is anyone to complain on how the truth is presented.
Some people resent Rush Limbaugh on how he presents the truth, some hate how Bill Maher presents the truth.....but if you peel back your dislike for how they present the truth........and look at it.......the truth is all that matters.

Maybe they both "fling shit"...but if you open your eyes there is truth in there.

 

lol so (R)eally (S)tupid chimes in to say there's no cogent arguments against WoV here..................but then in the very next paragraph he admitted he doesn't even read the posts here because they're "too long".............LOL!!!

typical Wov member............Dr Seuss must be more at his level.......