Blackjack Current feud with Qfit (Norman Wattenberger)

There's a weird side bet (royal bonus or something like that) that pays 2.5:1 for a two suited cards and 25:1 for KQ suited....or something like that. Not to mention a blackjack pays 1.5:1 and if you consider surrender, 0.5:1. I read "you need an X payout to win" as the lowest possible payout to make it a winner...not the lowest possible non fractional payout to make it a winner.


I don't say I'm a full time AP in the sense I work 40 hour weeks. I don't think any or many APs say that. It means this is their full time job and is their primary source of income. This would be opposed to a recreational or part time AP who plays occasionally on the weekends and likely has a regular full time job.

With many jobs, you don't just put in the X hours asked or required of you. You do whatever you have to do to get the job done.



Yes, KJ, we can agree the statement Norm made about you threatening shack is untrue. Happy?

 

Norm is saying that exoter is posting about him where he can't post. I think he is talking about this site. I don't know of anything that is stoping Norm from signing up and posting here other than he is to chickenshit.

 

Admin, a member of Norm's site questioned his statement that he '"could not" post here and here is his response. You will note he is referencing the site as GA, but he is clearly answering a comment about his statement of not being allowed to post here. I have no idea why he is saying 'GA' instead of GF. Maybe he has soap in his eye. Oh wait...it CAN'T be that.

 

In the screenshot that exoter put up of Norm's posts he (Norm) is referring to exoter's posts made on this site and saying he can't respond them....as if he doesn't have a right to respond here.

 

Two posts later, norm again referenced this site, again oddly referencing it as 'GA'.

"I have to add, GA allows homophobic, racist and anti-Semitic posts, including ample use of the n-word. A'int no way I will contribute to such sites. Indeed, anyone that does loses respect in my eyes. Anyone that repeatedly contributes to such sites is a nonperson to me."

 

For those wondering, why I am posting this stuff of and about a guy that doesn't post here, it is because as someone said it the past few days, (I think BWC), my involvement here and the whole incident of my banning at WoV, is really not about me, or Mike Shackleford. It is really comes back to Norman Wattenberger (Qfit).

Norm lives in an alternative universe. He is a compulsive liar. He exaggerates. He makes things up out of thin air, supporting his alternative "facts". He is an ego-manic and control freak and everything is about controlling the narrative regarding his brand, Qfit and his products.

Proof is his dozens and dozens of feud and online wars, with numerous members of the blackjack and AP community, including some pretty respected members. As soon as someone is the slightest bit critical of Norm or his brand, he goes to war with them. I have seen it occur over and over, in just my short time 9 years or so, involved in the community.

Why does this matter? Well it doesn't involving Norm's site. He has single-handedly destroyed his own site, banning and driving away most of the legitimate blackjack AP's that once populated his site. And of those that remain, they post and participate much less than they used to. The site is now dominated by a very small handful of mostly part-time, low limit player, who have an agenda and spew voodoo ideas, day after day. Plain and simple.....It is a voodoo site.

So again, you ask, why does it matter here? It became relevant when this ego-manic, control freak, tried to expand his alternative universe to other AP/gambling sites. When he trolled me to several sites that he did not participate at and lied and spread those alternative reality facts (lies and exaggerations), and most of all when he demanded of other site owners that they shut down someone who had a negative opinion of him and/or his site. It continues to astonish me that Michael Shackleford went along with it. He is the only one.

Up until now, it has been just my claims. But now finally there is a glimpse into who Norm Wattenberger really is. A glimpse into Qfit's alternative world. A glimpse into his need to 'control' and even his attempt to do so with this site.

 

Edit: Surrender should read 0.5-for-1, not 0.5:1 (0.5 to 1).

 

Stoner, bringing in sidebets like Royal Match and what is steering beyond the point. 2:1 is the offering, and 33% won't beat it. 2.000001 would beat it, but you won't find that fractional or decimal payouts in this sense on the felt. With regard to certain sidebets that do indeed pay a 2.5 bet, but with a minimum bet and spread that allows their dealers to take the action without having to bring in smaller denomination chips or .50 pieces.

At this point, you're arguing just to argue. 3:1 would defeat it, fact. Move on.

As for being a full time AP, I'm inclined to agree with KJ's take if your EV is high enough, but vehemently disagree with yours that any or "many" agree with it. For every "full time" AP you can think of under 40, I can name you ten who works 50+ hours a week, week in and week out. It simply makes no sense to limit yourself if you have the time to invest. Its for this reason that I've picked up EVERY possible AP play I can find, so when I'm on the road I can be making money. AP Slots? Got it. AP Blackjack, Got it. Poker, got it. Marketing? Done. Promos? Done. AP Plinko? I"m sure there's a way!

Point is, Stoner, you've gone out of your way to state that you don't compare to me in AP exploits like Slots, VP, Poker, Marketing, Promo, etc, and you've also gone out of your way to say you don't put the blackjack hours in like I do.

By your own admission, you don't compare. Yet, here, you try to compare. Make up your mind on it, man. I personally don't care. I size people up all the time, man, I know who is real, who isn't.

Its like Mickey, man. If he got his shit together, he'd be a damned good AP, but he's been battling inner demons for years and making enemies instead of friends, including me. I don't wish the guy ill will in any way, I'm not that kind of person, but I do have a limit to my kindness and respect. When I first came to this forum, it was to meet up with him and find a man name "richie dawg", I've since met Richie, and been let down. His reputation did not precede him. Mickey I'd still meet, though I'd be less excited to do so since he harbors animosity towards me for no logical reason. You, stoner, are putting yourself in that same boat with Mickey.

The only place I myself have posted those emails is here on this forum.

Only site those emails have touched, to my knowledge. I can't control what others do with them, but if Norm is claiming I've posted them anywhere else, he's sadly, sadly mistaken.

Stoner, I'm not one of those guys who is going to jump you for making an incorrect statement that holds little relevance to the real discussion.

Again, not here to fight with you.

 

I don't remember saying that, except for possibly poker. I'm sure you're good at what you do, you just come off as arrogant as all hell with the "I'm the world's best machine AP" nonsense.

 

lol

 

What does that have to do with anything? You yourself would be considered a low-limit player to some guys. Part-time isn't a bad thing either, I know some very smart people who play part-time because there have made so much they don't need or want to play full-time. I bet the best BJ player in the world(not sure how you would or could define that) only plays part time.

 

Socks rarely do.

 

24 hours up yet? BTW, Norm's response to this thread and challenging the statements and attacks he made was to move the thread in question, to the private section out of public view. Exactly what you would expect. Hide and cover up. Complete lack of transparency from a guy who always talks about openness and even uses Gandhi as his avatar. What a loser.

Absolutely. I know a number of low limit and/or part-time players that I would rank near the top. One low limit, weekend warrior type at BJinfo, I probably learned more from than anyone else. Billryan or Billyryan at WoV (participated here briefly under a different handle) is a low limit player, that I would rank as good and knowledgeable as anyone I know of. I have said many time, that I actually believe blackjack play works best as a part-time and/or supplemental thing, either with a job/career, or supplementing retirement or social security. Just not having all your eggs in one basket is a real good thing.

My comments were concerning that one specific member of Norm's site, who for 15 years presented himself as a weekend warrior type betting $5 and then after announcing "he would be know as one of the "blackjack greats", he literally overnight became this fulltime, blackchip player, playing a count and techniques that no one else could possibly understand. He has challenged some pretty math knowledgeable guys like Don Schlesinger, Norm himself and lately a published and pretty well known, 20 years professional high stakes player who has earned 10's of millions of dollars as a professional player.

Alex, you know fraud and you have called out fraud a number of times. Trust me when I tell you this guy is right up their with the worse case "posers" you have seen. Or better yet, don't trust me. Go read for yourself. Better allow some time though as this 'poser' now has almost 14,000 posts. lol

Very true. I generally refer to myself as a mid-level player. I think that is fair. My max bet ranges from $300 to $800, depending on the size of casino and level that other players are playing. (I try to avoid being one of the bigger bettors and at most of the local type places that means staying below $500.)

I have the BR to play much higher, 6 figures, replaceable should I lose that, so playing "mid-level" is a choice based on my top priority of longevity.

 

Oh, you were talking about one of them guys who make up a bunch of shit. Ya, I believe you, I don't have to read that site.

Someone said Exotor defended MM or something like that?

 

I read where Norm said Exoter defended MM. I didn't actually read where Exoter defended MM. Not saying he didn't, because I don't read everything anymore.

But Norm lies! I don't know any other way to say it. He distorts the truth.

For instance Norm has said that I supported MM, when I never did. I always said he was a snake-oil salesman. It took about 20 seconds of watching one of his videos to realize he didn't know what he was talking about. MM has the tiniest little bit of very basic knowledge concerning card counting, and was using that (mostly incorrectly) to try to convince people that had no knowledge, that he knew what he was talking about.

What I did was post that I thought it was amusing that Norm was feuding with this guy. Norm distorted that into posting I was supporting a known felon, Michael Morganstein.

Another example. I occasionally post on a site called Zenzone. It is mostly a dead site now. I only post there to annoy Norm. While it is a place that a number of legitimate professional players that Norm banned or feuded with ended up at, there was only one small section devoted to gambling and advantage play. Most of the site is a cesspool. Conspiracy theories, including a lot of hate "rhetoric". Racial, homophobic and anti-semitic attacks. I have never once posted in those threads. Yet Norm has stated, probably 30 times that I frequently "belong to" and post on a anti-semetic "hate" site. I don't know if you would call that a lie or an intention distortion, to try to make someone look bad or what?

So maybe Exoter defended MM, maybe he didn't. I wouldn't believe that until I saw it with my own eyes, based on Norm posting it.